Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > HVAC

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

View Poll Results: Which route?
Repair existing R-22 13 seer system with new air handler 2 16.67%
New R410a system, 13 seer 2 16.67%
New R410a system, 14 seer 8 66.67%
Other 0 0%
Voters: 12. This poll is closed

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 11-06-2012, 01:13 PM   #1
Extreme DIYist
 
Ethereal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NC
Posts: 74
Rewards Points: 75
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


Hi all,

I currently have a 13 seer 2 ton goodman split system on R-22. The indoor coil sprung a leak and after thinking over the possible courses of action, I am leaning toward replacing the entire (5 year old) system with an R401a system. Here's my (cost) reasoning:

New air handler: $500 here
7lbs refrigerant: $400
New filter/dryer installed: ~$200
Total: $1100

If I switch over to R410a:
Air handler and heat pump: $1400 here
Installation, charge(25ft lines): DIY(precharged)

Alternatively, I could go 14 seer for $90 more here, which uses the same heat pump but variable speed air handler.

So my first question is, between the 13 and 14 seer systems, does one of the air handlers have a better rep than the other? The 14 seer hax a TXV while the 13 seer does not. 14 seer would save me approx. $40/year in operating cost.

Secondly, The following is my plan of attack, and I just wanted to vet it with you guys to make sure I am not missing something important:
- Push Down existing system
- Break vacuum with argon/CO2 (I don't have nitrogen)
- Decommission existing handler and heat pump
- Braze new handler and heat pump in while flowing argon/CO2
- Pressure test system (leak down test)
- If no leaks, pull vacuum
- Open service ports to let refrigerant out of new condenser
- Test!

Thanks guys, I'm glad I found this forum and I know that I could have saved myself tons of time if I wandered over here sooner! I don't know much about HVAC yet but you might see me perusing other forums from now on

Ethereal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2012, 06:00 PM   #2
An old Tradesmen
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: PA
Posts: 26,023
Rewards Points: 3,712
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


Why not just replace the indoor coil your self, and have a tech top off charge when your ready. I hate to see a 5 year old unit get pulled.

The 14 SEER paired up with the right thermostat will get you better comfort. it can remove more moisture in the summer.

beenthere is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to beenthere For This Useful Post:
ben's plumbing (11-06-2012)
Old 11-06-2012, 06:13 PM   #3
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: winnipeg manitoba canada
Posts: 779
Rewards Points: 500
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


I agree 5 years not very old.......
carmon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2012, 06:20 PM   #4
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: pa
Posts: 4,535
Rewards Points: 2,384
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


agree 5yr old system would be a crime to remove .. as bt said just replace indoor coil..ben sr
ben's plumbing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2012, 06:52 PM   #5
Extreme DIYist
 
Ethereal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NC
Posts: 74
Rewards Points: 75
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


Thanks for the 14 seer vs 13 feedback, I think a little added comfort alone would make it worth the marginal added cost, especially since it can get pretty humid here in NC.

The reason I lean toward a new system is the cost involved. I can't find just the coil to replace (I have an ARUF182416 handler currently), and even if I did I would want an all aluminum coil to prevent future leaks. Plus, my current handler has mold growing on the inside and a new handler would have the bonus of saving me that hassle.

Referencing the above cost breakdown, that means $1100 to change the handler, have a tech fill me up with 7 lbs of R-22 (that stuff is getting expensive!) and change the filter-dryer... and then I still have a 5 year old heat pump that I know has been run with very little refrigerant. Or, $1500 for an entirely new 14 seer system that I can install entirely myself.

It just seems to me that $400 is definitely worth it to have a new, more efficient system that doesn't take solid gold injections to refill! I mean, if you consider the average life of a system to be 10 years, then I am already halfway in which means $750 in. And, I can sell the 5yr old heat pump on craigslist to recoup some of that and hopefully help someone else out that really needs it.

Thanks for the feedback guys, keep it coming!
Ethereal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2012, 06:57 PM   #6
An old Tradesmen
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: PA
Posts: 26,023
Rewards Points: 3,712
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


That coil is probably under a part warranty. they usually had a 5 year warranty.
beenthere is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2012, 08:04 PM   #7
Extreme DIYist
 
Ethereal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NC
Posts: 74
Rewards Points: 75
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


Quote:
Originally Posted by beenthere View Post
That coil is probably under a part warranty. they usually had a 5 year warranty.
I talked with Goodman today, my warranty expired in august. I replaced my second zone coil last year with the same failure, under warranty... $700 for the replacement, with a free coil on that one. I have heard all my techs groan about Goodman quality for a span of a few years, perhaps my units fall in that timeframe.

that gets me thinking, should I consider a different brand if I do change the whole system out?
Ethereal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2012, 08:07 PM   #8
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: winnipeg manitoba canada
Posts: 779
Rewards Points: 500
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


I would.......
carmon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2012, 09:23 PM   #9
An old Tradesmen
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: PA
Posts: 26,023
Rewards Points: 3,712
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


5 years ago. Every manufacturer was making questionable coils.
beenthere is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2012, 10:00 AM   #10
Extreme DIYist
 
Ethereal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NC
Posts: 74
Rewards Points: 75
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


Quote:
Originally Posted by beenthere View Post
5 years ago. Every manufacturer was making questionable coils.
And now they aren't? I think the most valuable knowledge my HVAC guys have is which brands and runs to avoid!
Ethereal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2012, 05:07 PM   #11
An old Tradesmen
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: PA
Posts: 26,023
Rewards Points: 3,712
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
And now they aren't? I think the most valuable knowledge my HVAC guys have is which brands and runs to avoid!
A lot of them pulled their production out of mexico. And reverted to using plants back here. They couldn't control the quality down there.
beenthere is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to beenthere For This Useful Post:
ben's plumbing (11-07-2012)
Old 11-08-2012, 10:38 AM   #12
Extreme DIYist
 
Ethereal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NC
Posts: 74
Rewards Points: 75
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


Well I pulled the trigger on the R410a system, because they had a 5% off promo going. I'll post a follow up when it's running with any notable observations! Not sure I mentioned, but the reason I went with acwholesalers.com is that they honor the mfr warranty, while the mfr will not since the purchase is online. They require a licensed tech to do the final inspection and initial startup in order for the warranty to be valid.
Ethereal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2012, 12:49 PM   #13
Part of the Clover Leaf
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NW Burbs of Detroit Mi.
Posts: 1,107
Rewards Points: 500
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
Well I pulled the trigger on the R410a system, because they had a 5% off promo going. I'll post a follow up when it's running with any notable observations! Not sure I mentioned, but the reason I went with acwholesalers.com is that they honor the mfr warranty, while the mfr will not since the purchase is online. They require a licensed tech to do the final inspection and initial startup in order for the warranty to be valid.
Make sure the if U use co2 that it is the BONE DRY type or better.

Anything less is soda fountain CO2 and is very wet.
hvac5646 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2012, 01:56 PM   #14
Extreme DIYist
 
Ethereal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NC
Posts: 74
Rewards Points: 75
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


Quote:
Originally Posted by hvac5646 View Post
Make sure the if U use co2 that it is the BONE DRY type or better.

Anything less is soda fountain CO2 and is very wet.
Thanks, I will be using an Argon/CO2 mix that I have for welding. I'll make some practice brazes to see what kind of oxidation I will get with it, and if they don't turn out clean I guess I'll have to use a different gas. Is there some type of specification for how dry gasses are?
Ethereal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2012, 02:26 PM   #15
Part of the Clover Leaf
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NW Burbs of Detroit Mi.
Posts: 1,107
Rewards Points: 500
Default

Installing new R410a system. 14 or 13 seer? Does my plan of attack look legit?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
Thanks, I will be using an Argon/CO2 mix that I have for welding. I'll make some practice brazes to see what kind of oxidation I will get with it, and if they don't turn out clean I guess I'll have to use a different gas. Is there some type of specification for how dry gasses are?
Yes,

Class III or IV is about as purified as you need...after that the cost becomes probative.

Uncle buys Bone-Dry (classIII) at about $60 for fifty pounds of liquid CO2.

It's advisable to use a flow regulator calibrated in SCFH.


Last edited by hvac5646; 11-10-2012 at 02:29 PM.
hvac5646 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Installing All New HVAC system aeridyne HVAC 8 01-08-2011 07:59 PM
Sprinkler System - Installing Valve Box tazmajazz Plumbing 3 01-06-2009 10:14 AM
installing a split system Jacques HVAC 6 07-10-2008 09:50 AM
Installing a mini split ductless system agenkin HVAC 1 06-14-2008 10:33 PM
Plan of attack? hyunelan2 Flooring 5 10-17-2007 11:35 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts

Copyright © 2003-2014 Escalate Media. All Rights Reserved.