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wombosi 04-20-2009 09:30 PM

help with third heat zone i just put in...
 
recently installed a third heating zone off my two-zone system and am having some trouble getting it to work (hot water circulating)

here's a shot of the boiler:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3574/...d7a62a.jpg?v=0
it's old but is nicely tuned and works well. i recently installed the water heater, fed hot water from the boiler during the winter, in the summer boiler is shut off and just feeds it town cold.
i believe the thing on the right is the circulator pump.


previous, my original two zones were plummed in with a "Y" fitting off the 1 1/4" pipe.

i installed the third zone similarly, with a Y that i wound up taking OFF the return of the original two (explained later).

here's the new zone, with the existing two:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3625/...9829e4.jpg?v=0
the one branching off to the right is the new zone.


now, the return:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3661/...d198a9.jpg?v=0

the two in the foreground were the originals, and the one on the right came in with the "y" fitting that i used on the supply.
originally i put in the new zone with regular T's. it didn't seem to get any water flow, so a friend recommended i use the Y.

along with getting rid of the Y here on the return end (because of needing to add the third), i replaced both the old drains and shutoff valves.


here's what's going on. i manually open the third zone valve (it's not wired to a t-stat yet.), with one of the other two open and calling for heat with it's t-stat.

the pipe immediately past the zone valve for maybe a foot or two is decently hot, but then turns cold. after i installed the Y i bled the radiator and the pipe at the top was hot, and i thought all was well.
now it appears again that nothing is circulating through.

is my problem the fact that i have regular T's on the return, creating some sort of turbulence with the returning water from the zone that comes in straight? my zone is turned off, the tenant has the two upstairs zones.
if i put Y's on the two returns that now have T's, will this fix it?
i have no doubt my circulator pump can get the water up to the attic, as it bleeds out with plenty of pressure.
what about using a monoflo T versus a Y at the return? is there an issue wit the T reducing the flow of water for everything it connects? with the Y, it doesn't reduce anything, as i understand it.

the upstairs zone that happens to return on the straight run without a T, i believe is working fine. the pipes are scalding hot to the touch, and even pretty hot on the return pipe.

FYI: my existing two zones have a large loop running around the basement and second floor, with monoflo T's branching off to each radiator (possibly on the return, i'm not sure).

the new third zone i installed is only leading to ONE radiator up in the attic, with all 3/4" pipe. the radiator is brand new. there are no leaks anywhere, etc...

any help on this would be greatly appreciated.

thanks!

beenthere 04-21-2009 04:38 AM

Install a drain valve(purge valve) like on the other zones, and purge the air out.

SULTINI 04-21-2009 05:59 AM

Balancing valves
 
Sounds like you might need balancing valves on the return lines to keep the pressure in the supply lines in check.

Might be feeding hot water to the other zones and starving the one you just installed.
Water will take the path of lease resistance just like air.

Test just to see if you get heat, shut off two old zones leave new zone open see how it works then.
If it works you know you need balance valves.

wombosi 04-21-2009 06:45 AM

hm..

the old return assembly that i chopped off had balancing valves. i didn't know it at the t ime, thought they were just old leaking globe valves.

so if i put balancing valves back on the original two, i should be OK?
what about the T configuration i have now? should they be Y's instead?
thanks.

if i close the two zones with t-stats and open the new one, will it work anyway, or does it need to be "calling for heat?"

SULTINI 04-21-2009 07:54 AM

First
 
Number one try this shut off the two old zones ( ball valves) make sure new zone is open ( ball valves) raise thermostat all the way up to call for heat check new zone, does it heat???

Yes or no???

Go from there.

Someone else might post another solution so let's wait and see what other mechanics say.

We will talk about balance valves later after the test.

PS. make sure the new zone valve is wide open

wombosi 04-21-2009 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SULTINI (Post 263393)
Number one try this shut off the two old zones ( ball valves) make sure new zone is open ( ball valves) raise thermostat all the way up to call for heat check new zone, does it heat???

Yes or no???

Go from there.

Someone else might post another solution so let's wait and see what other mechanics say.

We will talk about balance valves later after the test.

PS. make sure the new zone valve is wide open

the new zone does not have a thermostat yet so i can't call for max heat. i can manually open it and have the boiler ON, but that's about it.
is that enough to test it?

SULTINI 04-21-2009 12:02 PM

Yes
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by schmolze (Post 263419)
the new zone does not have a thermostat yet so i can't call for max heat. i can manually open it and have the boiler ON, but that's about it.
is that enough to test it?


Yes you can make sure circulator is on and water temps are high and you have flow to the new zone.


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