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Old 10-06-2008, 08:21 AM   #16
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


in our old home, we replaced the old octopus with a 92 eff. and the best thing was that we could remove the old chimney from the attic space (9 ft.) and turn it into a new bedroom with lots of room and no chimney to squeeze past! (we redid the roof at the same time) the wife loved it.

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Old 10-06-2008, 06:40 PM   #17
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


Hey dont worry about my toes, thier fine. Its the other part of my anatomy I manage to step on occasionaly thats painful.
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Old 10-29-2008, 12:29 AM   #18
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


I looked into newer units I am considering replacing a old Lennox G9D-110S. Seems the transformer & A/C relay installed by Sears retrofit job about 15 years ago just burned up. Stinks because now I have no heat either (fan controls + pilot are out too). Modulating units I've heard are best way to go. I replaced old water heater with Bosch tankless and love it. Everybody gets a hot shower + bills down 40-60% from old heater. I hope furnace shows similar results. Till then anybody know how to get wiring diag for old Lennox unit I need to fix it till I can purchase new furnace & its getting cold here now.
I used a on line estimator that took into account insulation house direction doors windows insulation ect. excellent FREE tool.
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Old 10-29-2008, 10:18 AM   #19
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


I just converted to a 95%. Go figure. I put them in and was watching my old 75%'er wasting heat all winter.

I got a damaged one that had been hit by a forklift. I took it all apart and banged it out and installed it.

So far my gas bill is less than half of what it was. If I got any more efficient the gas company would be paying me.

In all the 90+ furnaces I have installed I have never been back to fix one and I put my number on every unit I install.

Here is the bottom line. Get a unit with a 10 year warranty. This way if something goes wrong it will be covered including the service call.

Cost of energy will do nothing but go up. Ten years down the road you will be glad you did this as your gas bill will be a lot less than the ones who don't have one.
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Old 10-29-2008, 10:32 AM   #20
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


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Originally Posted by Marvin Gardens View Post
I just converted to a 95%. Go figure. I put them in and was watching my old 75%'er wasting heat all winter.

I got a damaged one that had been hit by a forklift. I took it all apart and banged it out and installed it.

So far my gas bill is less than half of what it was. If I got any more efficient the gas company would be paying me.

In all the 90+ furnaces I have installed I have never been back to fix one and I put my number on every unit I install.

Here is the bottom line. Get a unit with a 10 year warranty. This way if something goes wrong it will be covered including the service call.

Cost of energy will do nothing but go up. Ten years down the road you will be glad you did this as your gas bill will be a lot less than the ones who don't have one.
Hey Marv, PM with details brand,2 stg, VS ect. Mine is going this year too!
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Old 11-19-2008, 08:13 PM   #21
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


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I used a on line estimator that took into account insulation house direction doors windows insulation ect. excellent FREE tool.
Does anyone (Monster) have a link to this tool ?

I was thinking of getting a York Latitude Series 95% TG9S to replace a 25 year old Tappan furnance - has a small crack in heat exchange but leaking no CD - but would need to be replaced eventually ?!

Do you have to get a chimney liner w/ a 90 as well when you are venting w/ PVC? I know you need it with a 80 but the 90's are direct vent.

Was also told I need fresh air vent from outside into cold air return but it could help my 1949 Michigan house as it will take away from some of the other natural drafts trying to get it.

Any advise is appreciated !
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Old 11-19-2008, 08:31 PM   #22
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


the chimney liner is for the orphaned hot water heater
never heard of the outdoor air in the return eleminating drafts ask how much extra that is than tell them to put that in writeing with a money back guarantee see if they flinch

Last edited by kennzz05; 11-19-2008 at 08:35 PM.
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Old 11-19-2008, 09:35 PM   #23
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


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the chimney liner is for the orphaned hot water heater
never heard of the outdoor air in the return eleminating drafts ask how much extra that is than tell them to put that in writeing with a money back guarantee see if they flinch
Gotcha. I have my current hot water tank and furnance venting out the chimney now. I keep my hot water tank - and I guess I have to go from a 3" pipe to 4" pipe and if the hot water tank and 80% furnance were to vent the chimney I need a liner. Not sure why I need a liner if I am going w/ 95%

The outside vent is something they say is need in newer construction because houses are too tight. And apparently in my city, the inspector thinks getting new windows and insulation on a 1949 house makes it too tight. But the point I am considering is ... it could help me? Meaning it gives out side air an area to be sucked in ... therefore eliminating it coming in from other areas as much ?!
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Old 11-19-2008, 09:42 PM   #24
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


It does when the furnace or A/C is running, nut not when neither is running.

Depending on teh size of your chimney.
The water heater alone won't be able to keep it warm enough. And you wil get condensate forming in the chimney. Which will rot out your chimney.
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Old 11-19-2008, 09:54 PM   #25
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It does when the furnace or A/C is running, nut not when neither is running.

Depending on teh size of your chimney.
The water heater alone won't be able to keep it warm enough. And you wil get condensate forming in the chimney. Which will rot out your chimney.
I understand the concept and the damage it can do .. but if the 90% is vented outside directly via PVC. What has changed from my old school 65% and same water heater?
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Old 11-19-2008, 10:14 PM   #26
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


Your old furnace was helping to keep the chimney warm so condensate didn't occur, or occur as much.

If it did occur, when the furnace ran, it would re evaporate the condesate.(still caused damage sometimes)
Now without the furnace, the chimney won't be as warm, and of course, no heat from furnace to evaporate any condensate that forms.

A liner sized for the water heater, prevents this from happening.
Less area to heat up, and the flue gases move faster.
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Old 11-19-2008, 10:17 PM   #27
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


I bought a 25+ year old townhouse (1500sf, two floors, open stair case, 2 big sliding doores and 4 big windows and two sides exposed to Mother Nature).

I did not want to worry about the possibility of problems with the old heat exchanger and decided to replace the furance (the AC was newer).

For my situation, I could not justify the change to a 95% unit and went for a 80% unit that was smaller and had a variable speed fan to give me the confort and circulation.

Since the conversion, my electric (AC) bills have been much lower and the comfort is much improved. My heating bills (including dryer and hot water) have never approached $100/mo. even in the coldest Minnesota weather for a unit with north and east esposues. In the summer, my gas bill is about $20 including the usual monthly service charge.

For me, the extra cost to install 95% unit and be "green" and patriotic could not be justified for many, many years since everything else was sound and there was no major infiltration.

Every situation is different.
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Old 11-19-2008, 10:25 PM   #28
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


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I understand the concept and the damage it can do .. but if the 90% is vented outside directly via PVC. What has changed from my old school 65% and same water heater?
A 1949 Mi home should not need fresh air intake.

I live here and some of the smaller communities can't afford to keep a mechanical guy on payroll so they hire a qualified guy to be in the Bldg Dept office for two hours twice a week. Then they send out the structural or electrical inspector to read from a book. I have never had any problem with leaving off the fresh air intake after discussing it with a part time mechanical guys.

In the communities that have full time inspectors they don't usually ask for a fresh air intake on so old a home even if the home has been re-insulated and new windows added.

What part of Mi are you in?
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Old 11-19-2008, 10:37 PM   #29
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


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I understand the concept and the damage it can do .. but if the 90% is vented outside directly via PVC. What has changed from my old school 65% and same water heater?
Mi code requires a four inch liner for a lone vented draft hooded appliance to keep the fumes from cooling down into hydrochloric acid(no joke).

That will eat into your mortar and freeze and cause bricks to separate from hydraulic pressure.

the liner is an insulator to prevent damage to your chimney.
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Old 11-20-2008, 08:45 AM   #30
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Has anyone updated to high efficiency gas furnace?


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Originally Posted by hvaclover View Post
A 1949 Mi home should not need fresh air intake.

I live here and some of the smaller communities can't afford to keep a mechanical guy on payroll so they hire a qualified guy to be in the Bldg Dept office for two hours twice a week. Then they send out the structural or electrical inspector to read from a book. I have never had any problem with leaving off the fresh air intake after discussing it with a part time mechanical guys.

In the communities that have full time inspectors they don't usually ask for a fresh air intake on so old a home even if the home has been re-insulated and new windows added.

What part of Mi are you in?
Hi. I am in Royal Oak and was told the RO inspectors have been known to require the installation of fresh air make up units on new furnance installations - they have no legal grounds to do this but they do it anyways. This is what I am told. I guess the head RO inspector is also head of Oakland county. My heating/cooling person said that it may actually help me to have the fresh air as it will be a "forced draft" natural draft and help with some of unwanted natural drafts my house has.

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