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Old 01-31-2011, 05:12 PM   #1
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Fair Price.... ?


I want to take a moment and thank Nathan and everyone that participate on these boards, I have come across these boards several times in the past looking up information and it has always been helpful.
I do appreciate the professionals that take the time out and exhibit the patience to help inform the customers that lack the knowledge and expertise you have. Thank you.


I am in need to replace my current Carrier Heat pump and air handler, 2.5 ton 12seer at the time I bought it,,,, (13yrs old).
I am using emergency heat only now since there was a leak discovered in the outside coil so I am in sort of a hurry to make a decision soon. My power bill is shooting through the roof over the last few weeks as you could imagine trying to keep warm.


QUOTE 1.
My AC man gave a price for a 2.5 ton Heat Pump and Air Handler system of two manufacturers installed as:
1. Goodman 13sr $5,043
2. Trane 13sr $5,868
3. Trane 15xl $7590

QUOTE 2.
Another company quoted me these:
1. Trane 13sr $4800
2. Trane 15xl $7170 (offered me a active duty military discount down to $7000 even) and also included the air filtration system included.


I am a homeowner in the military and I really cant afford to throw money around, being smart with what I buy is a must for us all. My daughter does have allergies and the free air filtration system appeals to me greatly, is this a good buy or am I getting ready to be taken for a ride?
With a deployment looming, I want to make sure I am getting a good deal and a sense of mind while I am gone.

Thank you again for your time.

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Old 01-31-2011, 07:24 PM   #2
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Fair Price.... ?


Don't go on price alone . Ask for references & check them out. If something breaks does it take them a week to get the part in and another week to come out & make the repair, Etc, Etc,

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Old 01-31-2011, 08:52 PM   #3
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Fair, is whats fair in your area, and what each individual contractor needs to charge. To stay in business, and to be able to come out and take care of warranty issues if there are any.


A cheap price today. Could leave you wondering if the contractor is going to come back out and fix something next month or next year. After your warranty runs out and he can charge you.
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Old 02-01-2011, 02:53 AM   #4
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Yeah don't get hung up on price. Go with whoever properly sized the equipment (manual J), if they do that right odds are they will do other stuff right. BTW those prices are way low compared to my area...
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Old 02-02-2011, 08:36 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unicursalhex View Post
Yeah don't get hung up on price. Go with whoever properly sized the equipment (manual J), if they do that right odds are they will do other stuff right. BTW those prices are way low compared to my area...
What is your area may I ask?


This is truly a hard pill to swallow trying to understand price comparison in different areas being THAT far off.
Some areas are half of what I was quoted and your telling me that my price is way low compared to yours? What is your price in your area?

How can this be? I go to a car dealer in any state and as shady as they can be they wont be off by nearly as much as this industry prices can be in thousands of dollars.
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Old 02-02-2011, 08:50 AM   #6
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Cars are cars no matter where you go.
Heating/cooling systems are different where ever you go.

Take the advice of the posters and get a contractor that has been around and services your area.

Whatever amount you think you're saving up front won't be worth squat when you're deployed and can't be there to troubleshoot the system that you saved $500 on.

Thank you for serving...........
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Old 02-02-2011, 01:51 PM   #7
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If this is an R 410 system 1 may replace the refrigerant lines & 1 may not. I Replace refrigerant lines on any R 410 system if at all possible. I have seen systems installed with the old line set using 1/4 '' liquid line & 1/2 '' vapor line. when 3/8 & 3/4 should have been used. Doing the job right & someone to back up the equipment when something goes wrong is price less
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Old 02-02-2011, 04:41 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich33 View Post
What is your area may I ask?


This is truly a hard pill to swallow trying to understand price comparison in different areas being THAT far off.
Some areas are half of what I was quoted and your telling me that my price is way low compared to yours? What is your price in your area?

How can this be? I go to a car dealer in any state and as shady as they can be they wont be off by nearly as much as this industry prices can be in thousands of dollars.

3K to 15K would be the span. Too many variables involved to get any closer than that from sitting at my keyboard.
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Old 02-02-2011, 04:45 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich33 View Post
What is your area may I ask?


This is truly a hard pill to swallow trying to understand price comparison in different areas being THAT far off.
Some areas are half of what I was quoted and your telling me that my price is way low compared to yours? What is your price in your area?

How can this be? I go to a car dealer in any state and as shady as they can be they wont be off by nearly as much as this industry prices can be in thousands of dollars.
Car dealers don't install new cars. A new car comes completely assembled. And any and all warranty work is paid for by the car manufacturer.

And HVAC system is installed by the HVAC dealer, and all first year warranty labor comes out of his pocket(Certain trane units are 2 years labor warranty out of the dealers pocket).


With a car, with the exception of you not being able to drive it. When it needs a repair, you drive it to the dealer. So the car dealer doesn't have 10 or more vehicles loaded with inventory driving down the road. He can have what inventory he carries all in one location. Along with the parts companies will all deliver parts to him that day, when he needs one. So the mechanics are basically working either diagnosing or repairing/putting parts on cars.

In HVAC, you got multiple trucks/vans carrying inventory. And of course, the tech can't be putting on a part while driving. So HVAC pays money to a HVAC tech for driving, while a car dealer doesn't lose labor time.

So there is no way the 2 industries can be compared as far as pricing.
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Old 02-02-2011, 05:51 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich33 View Post

QUOTE 1.
My AC man gave a price for a 2.5 ton Heat Pump and Air Handler system of two manufacturers installed as:
1. Goodman 13sr $5,043
2. Trane 13sr $5,868
3. Trane 15xl $7590

QUOTE 2.
Another company quoted me these:
1. Trane 13sr $4800
2. Trane 15xl $7170 (offered me a active duty military discount down to $7000 even) and also included the air filtration system included.

Update to QUOTE 2.
He came out to look at the install and measure using the J method. This Trane Company has no complaints listed with BBB and been around since 02'.
Instead of the 7170 he first quoted he changed the quote to as listed:

1-Trane 4TWX5030A1000A 15xli heat pump 16.0 seer/13.0 eer/9.0 hspf ari #(3024337)
1-Trane 4TEE3F40B1000A Variable Speed Air Handler
1-Trane BAYHTR 1410 supplementary heat
1-Trane TCONT 802 Touchscreen Thermostat
1-Trane TFD210 Clean Effects Air Cleaner
1- 5 year labor warranty (no charge)
1- One year Maintenance (2visits)

Price 8,170.00
Spring Promo (1000.00)
Discount (358.00)
Total Price 6,812.00


They will use existing ductwork, repair duct as needed, install plenum, use existing ref tubing, flushed using approved r-410 kit, he said it was the appropriate size as well. Will also install pad on outside unit, new outdoor disconnects

Unit will have 10yr warranty, 5 year on all labor, 12 yr compressor.

Does not cover maintenance, but maintenance for 2 visits a year to clean and check system was 140.00 year due annually.

To install the XR15 system it would be all the obove but 5,616.00 installed.

Comments are welcomed.
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Old 02-02-2011, 06:01 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich33 View Post
Update to QUOTE 2.
He came out to look at the install and measure using the J method. This Trane Company has no complaints listed with BBB and been around since 02'.
Instead of the 7170 he first quoted he changed the quote to as listed:

1-Trane 4TWX5030A1000A 15xli heat pump 16.0 seer/13.0 eer/9.0 hspf ari #(3024337)
1-Trane 4TEE3F40B1000A Variable Speed Air Handler
1-Trane BAYHTR 1410 supplementary heat
1-Trane TCONT 802 Touchscreen Thermostat
1-Trane TFD210 Clean Effects Air Cleaner
1- 5 year labor warranty (no charge)
1- One year Maintenance (2visits)

Price 8,170.00
Spring Promo (1000.00)
Discount (358.00)
Total Price 6,812.00


They will use existing ductwork, repair duct as needed, install plenum, use existing ref tubing, flushed using approved r-410 kit, he said it was the appropriate size as well. Will also install pad on outside unit, new outdoor disconnects

Unit will have 10yr warranty, 5 year on all labor, 12 yr compressor.

Does not cover maintenance, but maintenance for 2 visits a year to clean and check system was 140.00 year due annually.

To install the XR15 system it would be all the obove but 5,616.00 installed.

Comments are welcomed.

Price: I don't care about.

Lineset: Should be replaced, not a fan of flushing. They should change that!!

Labor warranty: Have them make it 10 years through the manufacturer, make sure the warranty isn't through them.

Good on the 15xli. Assuming they did the Manual J and did it properly then sounds like you got a good company.

Did they assess the ductwork to make sure it can move the airflow that will be required with this system?
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Old 02-02-2011, 06:37 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seatonheating View Post
Price: I don't care about.

Lineset: Should be replaced, not a fan of flushing. They should change that!!

Labor warranty: Have them make it 10 years through the manufacturer, make sure the warranty isn't through them.

Good on the 15xli. Assuming they did the Manual J and did it properly then sounds like you got a good company.

Did they assess the ductwork to make sure it can move the airflow that will be required with this system?
Yes, he did assess the ductwork.

How do I find out if the manufacturer even offers a 10 year labor warranty? He was not specific as to who the 5 year was through but just that it was offered.
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Old 02-02-2011, 06:41 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich33 View Post
Yes, he did assess the ductwork.

How do I find out if the manufacturer even offers a 10 year labor warranty? He was not specific as to who the 5 year was through but just that it was offered.

Trane does, but at a price. A 10 year P & L manufacturer's warranty is worth much more than a contractor's "good faith" warranty. He could go out of business the day after your install and then you are screwed on labor warranty.

I sell every one of my systems with a 10 yr P & labor manufacturer's warranty. It should be the standard.
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:20 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich33 View Post
I am a homeowner in the military and I really cant afford to throw money around, being smart with what I buy is a must for us all. My daughter does have allergies and the free air filtration system appeals to me greatly, is this a good buy or am I getting ready to be taken for a ride?
With a deployment looming, I want to make sure I am getting a good deal and a sense of mind while I am gone.

Thank you again for your time.

How handy are you? You could consider doing some of it yourself if you are interested. Like pulling the lineset and prep-ing the duct work..

Do you have the option for natural gas backup heat rather than heat strips?

How cold is it in your area this time of year?

-Jeff

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