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Old 07-16-2007, 06:28 PM   #1
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


Kicked on the A/C today. Noticed when I got home the house wasn't cool and no air flow coming from the vents. Came down to check the furnace. Yep Frozen! My first thought was filter or low freon. The furnace is flashing a code in amber. 4 short and 1 long flash. Book indicates blower motor fault. Any ideas? Thank for the help
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Old 12-02-2007, 08:48 PM   #2
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


I seem to be having a similar problem. I got codes "44" and "41". When I get both, I'm instructed to check the wiring to the blower. The HVAC tech tells me that the blower is blown (pun intended) and it will need to be replaced.

I also followed the suggestions as if I got each code individually. In this case I was instructed to make sure the registers was opened (which are all open now as opposed to only a few being open). I was also told to check the filter... I did, and though dirty it didn't seem to be the problem.

So, I'm in a similar boat... any other suggestions other than replacing the blower?
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Old 12-03-2007, 12:48 AM   #3
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


Max, if your filter was dirty it may have caused a problem. Turn your furnace switch off then on now that you've changed the filter. If it does not start you'll need to call a service tech.

Last edited by Summit Heating & Air; 12-03-2007 at 12:49 AM. Reason: wrong word
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Old 12-03-2007, 01:19 AM   #4
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


I am not an HVAC tech, just a long-time DIYer. I rarely touch anything to do with our HVAC.
However, we had a 4-ton Carrier heatpump installed in 1998 to replace an Amana. The Carrier unit has had constant problems with the blower motor control module that attaches under it, not the blower motor itself. (Supposedly a Carrier engineering/design problem.)
I average replacing the control module about every 1-2 years. It has happened so frequently that I keep a spare module on hand, and change it out myself. (They cost about $200 =/-).
This is the first and last Carrier that I will ever have.
Your problem is probably the control module.
Mike
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Old 12-03-2007, 01:48 PM   #5
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


Hi mickd & all

A little information to help all of you with your current and potentially future problems. The blower motor that this furnace use is a D/C motor with an A/C pulse modulator on the back of it. With that being said, this particular design motors job is to deliver a constant CFM supply for the duct system. If you are using a high merve rated filter, this could be a potential cause for the motor module failure. But the most common cause is poor duct design. As I said earlier, this motor will continue to speed up to generate the required CFM. In doing so it also raises the statc pressure on the duct and causes excessive amperage on the motor and controller. This is what causes the majority of the contoller failure. The biggest problem when people retrofit with this beautiful piece of equipment is they never look at the duct to see if it can be used. This particular furnace is a God send for the consumer if the installing company is a knowledgeable one. The most common response you will get from the majority of installing companys is that there is nothing wrong with the duct work, it is the furnace. I have personally installed a great many of these over the years, including the one in my own house. The longest running one I have to date was installed almost 11 years ago with no mechanical failure period! The one in my own house has been here for almost 9 years its self. I cannot stress enough that when selecting a filter, by all means use a pleated filter. There is nothing better in a disposable filter for cleaning and air delivery. But please listen when I say not to use the ones that have the paper looking media. Use the filters with the soft polyester media and change them monthly. But above all, have your duct work calculated for .50 static pressure max including filter. If your HVAC man becomes defensive about your duct problem, find one that is a professional and is willing to fix the problem, not just C/O an expensive control module every year or so.

Good luck
Rusty
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Old 10-09-2008, 12:26 AM   #6
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


These high efficiency variable speed blower motors are maufactured by GE. They are used in many brands including Lennox, Carrier, Bryant, Payne, York and Trane.

There are two parts to the blower motor.

The two parts are the motor itself and the ECM module that is attached to the blower motor. The ECM looks like a black hubcab and it is attached, to the motor, with two long bolts.

You can remove the ECM module by simply unscrewing the two long bolts. You do not have to remove the blower motor from the mounting.

The motors in different series and brands are often the same. The difference is the ECM module. The ECM module must be matched up exactly or it will not work.

What usually fails on these high efficiency units is the ECM module. A service truck can not possibly carry all of the hundreds of ECM modules that are used in the various brands and series of brands.

However, the part that often fails in the ECM unit is part number SG379 which is a black disc about the size of a quarter in the center of the ECM.

You can look at the SG379 disk and often tell it has failed without any further checking. The disk will often be broken, brittle or disconnected from the circuit board, and there will be an obvious spot on the circuit board that has received a lot of heat. As long as the board is not broken, or deformed and the traces are in place, then this componet can be replaced. This component is designed to take a lot of heat and the circuit board will be discolored from the heat. This is normal and this is common.

This propierity part is a thermistor and it is used for surge protection as well as regulating the current to the motor.

SG379 has a finite life and like a light bulb it gets weaker and weaker until it finally just fails.

Although not available from GE or any or the HVAC companies, a SG379 part substitute, manufactured to OEM standards, is available from amazingkeys.com and can be soldered into the ECM circuit board in about 5 minutes.

If you are a serviceman, you can keep a few of these parts on your service truck and have the unit up and running in one service call and not have to replace the motor or the ECM. This also saves the customer a $1500 blower motor replacement or an ECM replacement.
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Old 10-09-2008, 12:44 AM   #7
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


Wow i wish i could of gotten help like this with all my problems! wow this is some of the best information i hav eyet to of read coming form a Professional for a Diy'er! Thanks guys fo rthe great info, though not of use fo rme, this is some great info for the users of the compatible system in discussion!
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Old 10-28-2008, 05:46 PM   #8
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


There's something else you need to know about the ECM, that has to do with the controller section of the motor. In the earlier design, when the controller is connected, there are three sliding copper contacts that are pins that go into mating holes in the circuit board. The problem here is that this is not a 'gas tight' connection.. air can get into the contact surface, and with it, moisture... and eventually there will form corrosion and the contacts will burn up from resistance accumulation. The newer ECM have a real connector here, male and female, in a solid locking plastic housing. The contacts in the newer units make very good contact and the plastic housing hold the contacts firmly.

So when you look into the mate up of the circuit board in the ECMs, look specifically for this lame, open, copper pin tri-connector, and plan on that failing from vibration/corrosion, maybe look to replace it either with solid wire soldered in, or some 'good' repair technique.

As to the pointer on the thermistor device, THANKS!!! I'll be able to repair my old motor with that info, and I'll also replace the lame tri-connector.

These motors are HELLACIOUSLY expensive.
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Old 06-21-2009, 09:16 PM   #9
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


AND expensive for no good reason. Carrier will not allow the dealers to get them repaired, because they want you to dump the 700 for a new mod and motor.

There is a point where the claims of efficiency are outweighed by the cost of repair. And with Carrier/GE motors and mods, that point was long ago met. They ought to be ashamed of themselves. This is a relatively simple unit (compared to you common home computer, or kid's video game), but the prices on them keep getting higher.

I understand that GE sold off the portion of the company that makes them. Hope springs eternal. It seems stupid that the cost of the motor and mod are one half the cost of a whole new blower unit on Ebay.
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Old 05-18-2010, 09:20 PM   #10
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


I followed the leads and guides and was able to replace the damaged thermister for only a few bucks, but with no good results.
I received the replacement ECM ($259) for my exact motor on the second workday. Shipping was free and my blower was up and operational in one hour. This sure saved me from an alternative of replacing my furnace- as I would have considered before spending a thousand for someone else to fix or hundreds invested to be told they need to replace with a new unit anyway! I sure am glad that there was someone willing to address a problem that Carrier doesn't want to deal with. I'm amazed that they designed the expensive ECM to act as a replacement for a five cent fuse. I'll go back to PSC motors for my next furnaces, at least they are more of a fix it yourself.
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Old 05-19-2010, 05:00 AM   #11
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


Carrier tends to always use the newest version of the ECM motor. So they generally have the most expensive one you can get.

The early motors(all ECMs) didn't have speed limiting programing. And the modules don't hold up well to running the motor at full or near full speeds all the time.
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Old 05-19-2010, 07:40 AM   #12
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


Yah, can you imagine what a plugged air filter must do to the speed and life of them. I had one try and collapse the ductwork it was so plugged and cavitating. People spend $4-6000 on a furnace and give you the deer in the headlight look when you tell them to spend $95 a yr on maintenance.
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Old 05-19-2010, 08:50 AM   #13
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Ya.

And then so many of them are installed to get "more" air to what ever rooms. On undersized ducts, and end up running at statics above 1.2". No wonder they burn out.
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Old 11-08-2010, 09:46 PM   #14
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


This and other posts with this information has been such a great help....I went from a quote to replace blower moter for 1300.00 to replacing the thermistor (SL22) for 1.68 and about 45 minutes of time (blower motor was just fine) So far, the furnace has worked great! Thanks to all of you for posting this information


Quote:
Originally Posted by bob reynolds View Post
These high efficiency variable speed blower motors are maufactured by GE. They are used in many brands including Lennox, Carrier, Bryant, Payne, York and Trane.

There are two parts to the blower motor.

The two parts are the motor itself and the ECM module that is attached to the blower motor. The ECM looks like a black hubcab and it is attached, to the motor, with two long bolts.

You can remove the ECM module by simply unscrewing the two long bolts. You do not have to remove the blower motor from the mounting.

The motors in different series and brands are often the same. The difference is the ECM module. The ECM module must be matched up exactly or it will not work.

What usually fails on these high efficiency units is the ECM module. A service truck can not possibly carry all of the hundreds of ECM modules that are used in the various brands and series of brands.

However, the part that often fails in the ECM unit is part number SG379 which is a black disc about the size of a quarter in the center of the ECM.

You can look at the SG379 disk and often tell it has failed without any further checking. The disk will often be broken, brittle or disconnected from the circuit board, and there will be an obvious spot on the circuit board that has received a lot of heat. As long as the board is not broken, or deformed and the traces are in place, then this componet can be replaced. This component is designed to take a lot of heat and the circuit board will be discolored from the heat. This is normal and this is common.

This propierity part is a thermistor and it is used for surge protection as well as regulating the current to the motor.

SG379 has a finite life and like a light bulb it gets weaker and weaker until it finally just fails.

Although not available from GE or any or the HVAC companies, a SG379 part substitute, manufactured to OEM standards, is available from amazingkeys.com and can be soldered into the ECM circuit board in about 5 minutes.

If you are a serviceman, you can keep a few of these parts on your service truck and have the unit up and running in one service call and not have to replace the motor or the ECM. This also saves the customer a $1500 blower motor replacement or an ECM replacement.
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Old 12-18-2010, 11:59 AM   #15
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Carrier 58MVP Blower Problem


GE+5sme39sL0005 Motor
OK There are 100s of posts about Carrier, trane and others with motor problem that can be fixed with a new thermister. Done that, replaced the themister. Have 2 motors both have the same problem .
Motor GE 5SME39-------The family of motors used on these Hi End furnaces
The problem
I cleared out the old fault codes in the ECM. It had 41 of course (blower outside valid speed range)
Hooked the motor up, Turn on the system and it starts through the runup process with enducer motor kicking on ect.
When it gets to the point where the computer tells it to Run the variable speed motor to test it I get a pulse that jerks the motor but it does not start and run. Then it shows Fault 44 (blower calibration fault).
I dont find this problem anywhere on the net. I dont think it is in the motor or the controller attached too the motor. Have 2 motors Replaced the thermister in one and hotwired around it in the other one.
This furnace had a problem for a while that it would stop working. If you turned the power off and back on a couple of times it would start and work for weeks or months.
This thing has a huge 12ADC Transformer on it, Weighs a couple of pounds. Could it be the transformer? How do you check one of these I get 120 volts to it but no voltage (I checked for 12) out of it. I suspect maybe the transformer only puts out voltage when it is gets loaded by the motor controller.
Guys Can you give me some things to check. Is there another component in the Motor Controller that is causing this problem (30 vilt thermister replaced with a new one). Point me to another place on the web that might help. Thanks
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