For all the HVAC experts! 2 level difference

bobinphx · 07-26-2012, 10:01 AM

I totally agree that pictures cant really show what is going on!!!! get a really good hvac tech (who will do a manual j and manual d) and then, if necessary have a really good tin knocker fix what needs to be fixed...

as to zones... personally, I have not seen a zone system that works well. Now please understand that I have limited exposure to zone systems. I know that in commercial systems Zones work well, but in residential, Ive only seen a few... and they had high static pressures and bypass ducts that really brought the economy of the system into question in my mind... I dont doubt that zones can be done, I just have not seen any.

Note that my point in this and the other posts is that as a consumer, you need to educate yourself. I hope that my posts lend some base information that the HO can then use to research and learn about his hvac system. This serves two fold. One the consumer does not get ripped off by hacks (and there are hacks in every trade and walk of life, so I am not picking on hvac techs) ... and so that the HO can save energy (yes I was around in the 1970s where saving energy was important!!! LOL)

scottmcd9999 · 07-26-2012, 11:15 AM

Residential zoning has come a long way, but like anything else dealing with a complex mechanical system, it must be installed properly. I too have seen some butchered zoning jobs, but with proper installation (the bypass should NOT just jump the supply and return, for example) and setup, a zoning system can be a great addition to a multizone structure.

I'm not sure what you mean by the "economy" of the system, but in general a properly zoned system will be as economical as any other, and in fact will often be more economical overall, since the homeowner can often avoid the cost of a second system.

techpappy · 07-26-2012, 01:07 PM

Set you thermostat to "cool - on"..this should result in your air circ fan runnining on continuous low/med speed and then when the stat calls for cooling the fan will kick into High speed. Cool air is denser and harder to move than warm air during heating season so, the continuos fan during cooling provides constant circulation and more even temperatures throughout. Easiest test to do. Let run this way for a day or two to see if things improve. If the stat doesn't result in the described operation check wiring ay stst and furnace to ensure you have a multi speed motor and that it is wired correctly according to wiring diagrams.

turnermech · 07-26-2012, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by techpappy

Set you thermostat to "cool - on"..this should result in your air circ fan runnining on continuous low/med speed and then when the stat calls for cooling the fan will kick into High speed. Cool air is denser and harder to move than warm air during heating season so, the continuos fan during cooling provides constant circulation and more even temperatures throughout. Easiest test to do. Let run this way for a day or two to see if things improve. If the stat doesn't result in the described operation check wiring ay stst and furnace to ensure you have a multi speed motor and that it is wired correctly according to wiring diagrams.

I some what disagree in the fan changing speed from fan on to fan cool. By the pic of your furnace I would supect a old shool fan center wich would energize the fan on the same speed for either. tstat will send G signal to fan relay No Y signal would be used in the relay fan would come on same speed for cool blower or constant fan blower. Newer furnaces use fan/control boards which reconize a Y signal and run the blower different with it or with out it. Your fan will only changes speeds from heat to cool or heat to blower on. It has a fan limit which turns the blower on in heating on a different speed. I ofcourse could be wrong.
But certainly try running fan to on setting to see if helps your problem.

biggles · 07-26-2012, 04:04 PM

do you have returns in the basement definitly on the first with the first floor stat location.check the supply ducts ..tight and sealed with brushed on sealant do you have a return on the 2nd floor.the heat from the attic/roof is pulling on what cooling is making it up there.any sun hitting walls.floors,furniture pulls on the system adding loads....should be HI-FAN in cooling...if you have a basement return try blocking it to see if it pulls 1st and 2nd more...18F on the evap fan section drop... 10F out on the condenser air rise

Evstarr · 07-26-2012, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbo

and if you can leave the fan running instead of having it on auto it will help to cycle the air.

This works for me! Fan is on all the time and ac runs less and house is nice and comfy! Must have a return in bsmt to be most effective!

wetbar · 07-27-2012, 03:34 AM

You can also try putting in line blowers in the ducts going upstairs. Thay are cost about 63.01 and fairly easy to install. I had a loft that I did this to and it worked great.

http://www.lowes.com/pd_223430-1061-...AID=1023984600

federer · 07-30-2012, 12:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobinphx

all I can tell you is that I had the same type issues, up stairs was hotter then down stairs. I was able to fix it without pulling out the old ducts in the walls. There is no longer a difference in temp and the bills went down by 25 percent. that is my experiance.

as to the pictures. picture 1. You have what looks to be a bulls head "t". sorry to say but that is the worst (as far as equvilant duct length) goes. The air is comming up and then hits the juctions and is not guided into the horizonal ducts. Lots of static pressure here!!!! this should be a nicely bent WYE. its good that the ducts can be seen. I would have a new wye made and put in.

picture 2 standard looking supply register of the stamped steel type, with dampener in the back. there are better registers in terms of air flow.

picture 3. appears to be a return, but its screwed to the wall... so where is the filter?????

picture 4. outside unit.

pic 5.. supply and return at air handler. Looks way restrictive at return and see the square supply duct (white paint) that is leaking so bad that the dust has made a pattern.... that needs to be sealed, as do all other exposed seams etc.

so... I suspect that the return is causing high static pressure, as is the bulls head T... get them fixed with new sheet metal... google for more info about the alternatives to the T and how a good return should be designed.

thank you so much for your specific input. yea there is bad leakage at the source! that dust is so bad. so the system is badly designed to begin with.

federer · 08-08-2012, 12:47 AM

sorry been so busy trying to catch up on the replies. just want to thank all of you for the input. i will consider it