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Old 01-29-2014, 07:03 PM   #91
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


Yes, the trap has been washed out several times. 1st time was not until after the 1st season (over a year after the install). Lots of black gook (slimy mold) came out. Since then it has been routinely done. Now it seems I am doing it every few weeks. We have very poor water (very hard), and no softener.

Regarding the inducer...since I put the dedicated combustion air piping in, the furnaces seems much quieter, however, now I am hearing a new sound that is the inducer, like loud vibration, that comes and goes during a typical heat cycle. It is so bad that if you are sitting over the furnace (sitting in the room above it, the dining room), it sounds like someone is in the basement running a piece of equipment on and off at random intervals, yet all the while you hear the normal sound of the air coming out of the registers. When you lightly touch the shaft on the motor of the inducer, the sound goes away. Perhaps this is another sign of the death of the inducer?

Now, I am need of some edumacation here regarding the relationship between the inducer and the condensate trap.

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Old 01-29-2014, 08:20 PM   #92
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


The trap only "traps' the condensate. Doesn't care what the inducer does.

The inducer simply creates a draft through the furnace, causing combustion to be drawn into the burners, and pushes the combusted gas out the flue pipe.
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Old 01-29-2014, 08:46 PM   #93
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


I guess I should go further and ask about the relationship between the trap and the pressure switch. Reason being that I am thinking of the "stuck open Pressure Switch Error".

1. Dying inducer
2. backing up condensate.

Leaning towards the condensate since I can clear the error by gently blowing out some of the condensate then restarting.

But the noises the inducer has been making cause me to thing of the inducer failing.

All this said, I am curious about a new design out there for the trap, or the potential for "building" my own.....
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Old 01-30-2014, 04:42 AM   #94
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


A clogged trap allows the condensate to back up into the inducer so that it spins slow and can't develope enough vacuum.

Might try rerouting the vacuum hoses. Also make sure if your pressure switches have small bleed holes on the ports, that they are not covered by the hoses.
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Old 01-30-2014, 04:07 PM   #95
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


]Yes, the trap has been washed out several times. 1st time was not until after the 1st season (over a year after the install). Lots of black gook (slimy mold) came out. Since then it has been routinely done. Now it seems I am doing it every few weeks. We have very poor water (very hard), and no softener.


A properly burning furnace should NOT be producing black slimy mold and gook. Like I said earlier your secondary heat exchanger tubes are fouled up/plugging up and restricting the drainage. Are you burning Propane?

Has nothing to do with your water supply as it is water that is condensed from the exhaust fumes that creates the condensate and that water comes from combustion air.
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Last edited by yuri; 01-30-2014 at 04:11 PM.
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Old 01-30-2014, 06:16 PM   #96
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


Yes Yuri you are correct, my bad. I was discussing my instantaneous water heater with the tech while he was cleaning the furnace, and we were talking about how bad the water is where I live......

The black slimy gook was from the first cleaning of the trap, after running a season then sitting idle for months before the next season. Since then, the only stuff that comes out appears to more like a scale-type material, but not much at all....Also, note that when I installed this furnace, I did nothing to the trap, so I have no ideal if there was already something built up in there or not (doubtful though.)
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Old 01-30-2014, 06:58 PM   #97
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


If it was me I would get your tech to order a gasket for the collector box that the inducer sits on ( if it has one or else they use RTV silicone) and then remove it and check the secondary heat exchanger tubes for fouling. sounds like you need a new inducer anyway and he can do that inspection at the same time.
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Old 01-30-2014, 07:56 PM   #98
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


he pulled the inducer off, then removed the face off the secondary collector and we looked at the tubes (stainless) and they were impeccable. He had adequate light and we looked far down the tubes, but could not see any type of build up at all.

As for the inducer, I am buying a new one. The noise alone is enough for me to replace it as now my ear is totally drawn to that thing and it's intermittent noise.
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Old 02-08-2014, 07:36 PM   #99
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


so, an update....
I bought the new inducer and installed yesterday. 1st thing I noticed when I turned the power back on...I had no idea there was a call for heat. the inducer was so quiet that I had to put my ear down to the motor to verify it was running. Now a day later, everything is fine. Only prob now is that it is so quiet, I am picking up other things, like slight vibration coming through the floor here and there....

Oh, I also flushed the water heater (1st time since it was installed in 2009) and that went well.
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Old 02-15-2014, 01:27 PM   #100
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


Had a similar problem a few years ago with a York. After a couple of service calls, replacing a couple pressure switches, among other useless fixes, a sharp tech found the problem. I have one of those little condensate pumps on top of a little box reservoir. Sits on the floor next to the furnace. The drain from the furnace, solid PVC, dropped into a hole on the cover of the pump assembly. Turns out the PVC was too long and would become immersed when the reservoir level was just near the upper limit before being pumped out. Long story short, If all the conditions were right, it would foul up the pressure switch and the system would shut down. Let it dry out, the system worked until the next perfect set of conditions. He cut about 1/2" off the drain pipe, and it has been working fine ever since.
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Old 02-17-2014, 11:27 AM   #101
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


More Noise!

So, as stated earlier, now the system is running very smooth and very quiet, however, and this could be part of the learning of the stat..., I am hearing a loud rumble and and feeling a vibration in the room directly over the furnace and flue. when I changed the tstat, I am most certain that I never heard the furnace go to full firing rate, though it was different as the furnace would cycle 3 times an hour, so it was always running but running long and at a low rate. Now it is still cycling 3x per hour, but the run times are shorter and it is getting to the max firing rate once in awhile. It is during the end of a high fire rate cycle when I hear the rumble and feel the floor shake slightly. When I check the furnace, I can only detect the slightest vibration in the flue. A week ago, I went and lined all the flue hangers with some foam insulation, but it did not do much good. I do not notice any vibration in the ductwork...still looking!
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Old 02-18-2014, 07:21 AM   #102
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


Last night the furnace was rumbling louder than ever since all the recent work done. This was again, towards the end of a heating cycle with the furnace running at a high rate. I went and found the flue, CA and ductwork all vibrating. I pulled the door off and checked the flame and it was a orange-yellow and looked very violent (jumping around a lot). I have never looked at the flame during a high fire rate, but I am assuming that this is not correct. Now I am curious if I have a gas, flue or combustion air problem. Time to check the pipes.

This am, I checked it again when it was rumbling (not as bad as last night) and the flame was more to my liking (See attached).
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Old 02-18-2014, 08:21 AM   #103
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


Not sure what system York uses for modulating but you should get the tech to check the firing rate and combustion at high fire. If it out of whack and having too much gas with not enough air it will rumble and start producing soot and plug the exchanger. There are special procedures with Lennox to do that as the inducer runs at different speeds/capacity to match the gas input and everything has to match at the different mod rates. Sounds a bit dangerous to me and should be checked ASAP.
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Old 02-18-2014, 09:40 AM   #104
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2008 York Modulation Furnace PM9C Issues


This is something that has been growing for awhile now. Guessing it started about a week after the new tstat was installed. Thinking I never noticed it before now because when the new tstat was installed, the furnace never got to a high firing rate, but as time goes by and the tstat "learns", the run times are getting shorter, but the firing rate is increasing.

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