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-   -   one piece shower pan - cutouts at bottom? (http://www.diychatroom.com/f15/one-piece-shower-pan-cutouts-bottom-92781/)

GMAGDNA 01-19-2011 12:02 AM

one piece shower pan - cutouts at bottom?
 
Not sure I'm posting this in the correct forum...

We have a typical standing shower stall, similar to this one:
http://www.extremehowto.com/xh/artic...ticle_id=60449

My question - just inside the door on the top edge of the pan on two sides (both water control and bath tub side) there is a little indentation about one inch wide by a half inch tall molded into the pan. What are these?

I would not think these vent to outside the pan but the exterior sheetrock next to the indentation on the water control wall appears to have moisture damage.

Thanks in advance.

oh'mike 01-19-2011 06:02 AM

You need to post a picture or two of the situation--Then you will get some answers--Mike--

Michael Thomas 01-19-2011 08:18 AM

We had a "discussion" of these over at InspectionNews a while back: Two overflow holes on shower base.

My conclusion is "no one really knows", so I'll be interested to see if anyone here has more information.

Meanwhile, ff you can ID the manufacturer of your shower base, I'll follow up with their tech support and try to get an answer.

GMAGDNA 01-19-2011 11:04 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Michael T - the linked thread you provided is EXACTLY what I'm talking about (picture attached for others).

The drain screen has the letters "ELM" molded into it so I think it is manufactured by http://www.mustee.com and the specific product is http://www.mustee.com/product-lines/...ctangular.html, Model 3442M.

I thought they were possibly weep holes but with allowing water to seep behind the sheetrock I wasn't certain. I suppose they are sloped slightly toward the pan but apparently not enough. If they are weep holes I guess I shouldn't seal them but I also don't want the sheetrock to remain wet.

I'll appreciate any insight you can gain from their tech support, or thoughts from anyone on this forum.

Thanks again!

Ron6519 01-20-2011 01:42 PM

You might try calling the company about them.
Ron

Mop in Hand 01-21-2011 09:21 AM

They are weep/overflow drains. They are placed near the shower door so the water that gets on the upper rim will not flow towards the bottom of the door. You mentioned "allowing water to seep behind the sheetrock" ??? There should not be any sheetrock behind the tile.

GMAGDNA 01-21-2011 11:20 AM

MopHead:

The weep holes do no appear to be dead ends. I looked into them and straight in they appear to stop at the liner behind the tile. However, they appear to make a 90 degree turn toward the door so the sheetrock being damaged is outside the door, not behind the tile. In other words, water enters the weep hole and makes the 90 degree turn to "spill" outside the enclosure. I will add, at the 90 degree turn the weep hole is open only half the height of the opening at the pan. So it seems in theory the water should not leave the enclosure. But only in theory.

Your explanation of the intent makes perfect sense. The design just seems to be slightly flawed.

Or maybe the 90 degree turn is supposed to be caulked?

Ron6519 01-21-2011 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GMAGDNA (Post 575022)
MopHead:

The weep holes do no appear to be dead ends. I looked into them and straight in they appear to stop at the liner behind the tile. However, they appear to make a 90 degree turn toward the door so the sheetrock being damaged is outside the door, not behind the tile. In other words, water enters the weep hole and makes the 90 degree turn to "spill" outside the enclosure. I will add, at the 90 degree turn the weep hole is open only half the height of the opening at the pan. So it seems in theory the water should not leave the enclosure. But only in theory.

Your explanation of the intent makes perfect sense. The design just seems to be slightly flawed.

Or maybe the 90 degree turn is supposed to be caulked?

I've never seen these indents go anywhere or do anything. The lip that surrounds the shower base is continuous.
The water damage is from something else.
Ron

GMAGDNA 01-21-2011 12:28 PM

Here are the reasons I am quite certain the damage is from the weep hole:

1) I stuck a pipe cleaner in the 90 degree turn and was able to insert it further than the distance between the pan and where the lip should have stopped it.

2) in looking at the pics and diagrams on the Mustee site I don't see there's a raised lip around edge on all four sides. Specifically, there does not appear to be a lip on the one side where the door mounts. I think you can just barely see these weep holes in the pic, on the sides perpendicular to the lip.

3) The reason I found the water damage and started looking at the weep holes was due to ants. They were in the corner next to the shower door and entering a poor caulk job on the baseboard. Because the ants were also in the pan and coming in through the weep hole...you see where I made the discovery the weep hole is not sealed. Verified with the very scientific pipe cleaner in #1 above.

Ron6519 01-21-2011 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GMAGDNA (Post 575053)
Here are the reasons I am quite certain the damage is from the weep hole:

1) I stuck a pipe cleaner in the 90 degree turn and was able to insert it further than the distance between the pan and where the lip should have stopped it.

2) in looking at the pics and diagrams on the Mustee site I don't see there's a raised lip around edge on all four sides. Specifically, there does not appear to be a lip on the one side where the door mounts. I think you can just barely see these weep holes in the pic, on the sides perpendicular to the lip.

3) The reason I found the water damage and started looking at the weep holes was due to ants. They were in the corner next to the shower door and entering a poor caulk job on the baseboard. Because the ants were also in the pan and coming in through the weep hole...you see where I made the discovery the weep hole is not sealed. Verified with the very scientific pipe cleaner in #1 above.

There's no lip in the front because that's the threshold where you step into the shower. There's an installation procedure that caulks the tile under and behind it. There's also a way to attach the wall material so it does not come into contact with the end of the shower base. You butt it up to the side, not put it in front. You would then caulk the space between the end of the wall material and the shower base. The tile would go over that, caulking behind and under where it hits the floor.
Where is the damage? Post some photos.
Ron

GMAGDNA 01-21-2011 06:26 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Ignore the muck in the photos - previous owners did not do so good maintaining the shower.

Photo on left is taken down the bottom edge of the door sill, toward the wall. You can see the weep hole on the left with the water damage being directly across from it on the right, outside the shower. While I took a few more photos in which you can better see the water damage, can't see that's of value to post. Behind the damaged area is partly the master bathroom (not near the plumbing) and partly a load bearing wall. Water damage is isolated to an area of about 4 inches, radiating from the corner of the wall, baseboard and shower wall intersection.

Photo on right is as close as I could get to the weep hole and still stay reasonably focused. You can see what I mean by it taking a 90 degree turn, towards the outside of the pan. The bit of mucky brown stuff at the front of the hole is caulk which stops just inside the hole.

I just realized I may have written some confusing construction details by referring to an enclosure. The shower walls are 6" white ceramic tiles, pan is a fiberglass product from Mustee, assume the shower walls are theirs, too.

Ron6519 01-21-2011 07:41 PM

It's a release trough. It's lower then the surrounding rim. Water that sits around the perimeter will fall into the trough, as it builds up, and fall back into the base.
If the water damage is outside the areas in front of the release area, the installation details were done incorrectly.
Ron

Mop in Hand 01-21-2011 10:19 PM

So, why don't you just clean it and caulk it?

Ron6519 01-23-2011 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mop in Hand (Post 575362)
So, why don't you just clean it and caulk it?

The recesses are there for a reason. They are not the problem.
Caulking them will do no good.
The issue is in front of the recesses. They need to be exposed, dried, cleaned and caulked.
Ron

Mop in Hand 01-23-2011 11:30 AM

I get it Ron. I've installed this type before. My best guess is that the install failed. I also should have explained myself further. I should have said in front of recess. I did not mean to fill the trough with caulk.


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