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Rekonn 06-08-2013 12:36 PM

Kitchen layout ideas
 
I'd like to see if my kitchen layout can be improved in order to get:

1) A good spot for a larger fridge. Our current one is 30" wide as opposed to today's standard of 36". A fridge in that spot also makes the mudroom entrance tight.
2) add a small island, maybe 4'x3'?

I'm thinking of taking down the wall between the kitchen and the dining room. Not sure what to do with the mud room. Any ideas welcome!

http://imageshack.us/a/img707/3761/floorplankitchen.png

GBrackins 06-08-2013 04:31 PM

are you redoing the kitchen cabinets?

Rekonn 06-08-2013 05:00 PM

Yup, complete remodel, probably down to studs. New cabinets, appliances, plumbing, electrical, floor, etc.

GBrackins 06-08-2013 05:07 PM

I would recommend going to a local lumber yard with a kitchen designer. they will take measurements of your kitchen, show you the various lines of cabinetry they carry and features of each and prepare 3d models for free ...... part of their sales pitch

you could recess the refrig in the wall between the dining room and kitchen (12"), just extend that small area next to the built in china cabinet. install a small counter that would be flush with the front of the refrig.

I like to keep the refrig near the entrance to the kitchen so you don't run the risk on moving a pan of hot grease from the stove and have small ones running into the kitchen to grab a juice box and hitting the pan.

GBrackins 06-08-2013 05:08 PM

I would try to leave the mudroom as an air lock to keep the cold winter winds from blowing straight into the kitchen.

wkearney99 06-08-2013 06:26 PM

I second the advice to use a kitchen design place. Most will work up a rough sketch at no cost as part of their sales pitch.

Which is your daily entrance door? What're your most common uses and paths? As in, which rooms see what kinds of travel?

Is there any desire to change the mudroom entrance? What's purpose of the 7'8"x10' room? What's the door at the top side of the dining room?

Rekonn 06-08-2013 11:02 PM

Great idea, I'll check out a kitchen design spot, looking forward to seeing what they come up with.

The front door, below the vestibule in the pic is the door used 90% of the time. The exit door off the mudroom is used mainly for taking out the trash. Currently, we enter the kitchen using both entrances (from dining and foyer) equally.

Yes, I have a desire to change the mudroom entrance as I need to turn sideways to get into it. The folding door robs ~4" on one side, and the fridge sticking out robs another ~5" from the other. The floorplan make it looks like the fridge is flush with the wall, but it isn't.

The 7'8"x10' room is an office, and the door at the top of the dining room goes to a sunroom.

wkearney99 06-09-2013 07:36 AM

What's the outside mudroom porch? Any chance of moving that door? As in, toward the office or in through were the sink and window are currently. Then lose the mudroom entirely and extend the kitchen into the old mudroom space.

Or what about making it a straight-shot from the center hall out to the mudroom room? That would free up the corner it's door takes in the kitchen. The question would be whether or not that wall has anything in it (ducts, plumbing, wiring), or carries loads that would affect it's framing. Those factors can be dealt with, but at an increase in cost and complexity. The same thing could be said for the wall between the kitchen and the dining room.

It's worth thinking outside the box on this. If only to confirm what would truly be an excessive amount of effort/cost to work around.

As it stands you have an pretty poorly sized 'work triangle'. It's a schlep from the fridge to the stove and the sink. It's better to have a tighter working path between those to minimize how much the cook might have to cross paths with anyone else in the space. But it helps to make sure whatever else others might need are at an accessible corner. As in, keep the fridge near the most open side of the travel path, so others don't have to cut in-between the cook to get to it.

user1007 06-09-2013 08:10 AM

Have you looked into distributed refrigeration at all? It is dropping in price and I think has even made it down to the level of perhaps special order from places like Sears.

Refrigerators date back to the designs for turn of the century ice boxes where one block of ice cooled everything. But when you think about it, doesn't it make more sense to put things like veges and meat in refrigerator drawers by the sink? And have a dedicated beverage frig just for soda, wine, beer or whatever elsewhere in the room and more accessible to the kids and so forth. As it is know, whenever someone reaches for a soda, the giant door swings open and 900,000cf of cool air blasts into the room and has to be cooled back down again.

And when you think about it, frigs are pretty big and ugly things even if in designer brushed metal or whatever the current trend. By incorporating smaller and distributed frig and freezer units you gain space that could be used for cabinets. I talked some clients into the approach and they really like it. Granted, you do gain extra sets of systems to maintain but still. Gone is the giant elephant in the room.

http://ec1.ostkcdn.com/images/produc...008156_320.jpg

http://www.thekitchendesigner.org/st...r%20paykel.jpg


https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/i...zSZSMFhC6pD2lA

user1007 06-09-2013 08:11 AM

To your question. The old approach to kitchen design was to orient the stovetop/oven, sink and frig in as close to a maneuverable triangle as one could get a way with.

Two Knots 06-09-2013 08:24 AM

Do you know what style cabs you want?
Do you know what type counter tops you
want?
What kind of appliances do you want?

I have a galley kitchen, and moved my fridge
down to the end. I previously had a GE proline,
as it was the shallow in depth and narrow in width.

What a piece of junk it was. Last summer I
got a kenmore French door fridge and it's wonderful.
It's the only fridge I could find that was not as deep
as all the other fridges.

We also took out the two by fours in back of the fridge,
and framed it out (like you would frame out a window) and the fridge fits
inside the frame ...thus, after we put compressed
fiberglass in the frame we picked up about 3".

The reason I mentioned this, as I have some thoughts
for a design for you, which includes taking out your
2 x 4's in back of the fridge.

Rekonn 06-09-2013 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wkearney99 (Post 1197857)
What's the outside mudroom porch? Any chance of moving that door? As in, toward the office or in through were the sink and window are currently. Then lose the mudroom entirely and extend the kitchen into the old mudroom space.

Or what about making it a straight-shot from the center hall out to the mudroom room? That would free up the corner it's door takes in the kitchen. The question would be whether or not that wall has anything in it (ducts, plumbing, wiring), or carries loads that would affect it's framing. Those factors can be dealt with, but at an increase in cost and complexity. The same thing could be said for the wall between the kitchen and the dining room.

It's worth thinking outside the box on this. If only to confirm what would truly be an excessive amount of effort/cost to work around.

As it stands you have an pretty poorly sized 'work triangle'. It's a schlep from the fridge to the stove and the sink. It's better to have a tighter working path between those to minimize how much the cook might have to cross paths with anyone else in the space. But it helps to make sure whatever else others might need are at an accessible corner. As in, keep the fridge near the most open side of the travel path, so others don't have to cut in-between the cook to get to it.

Yes, outside the mudroom there's a porch with a set of stairs that goes down to the ground level where I keep trash cans. I think there's no chance of moving that exterior door. It's a brick exterior house, and I've been told it's pretty much impossible to match new brick to old brick on a house.

I like the idea of straight shot from center hall to mudroom! Making a wall out of where the sliding door is now would let me add more useful cabinets/countertop space in the new corner, and allow me to put a fridge basically in front of where the folding door is now.

Agreed on thinking outside the box, and that the current work triangle is large. I have a lot of freedom to design something that minimizes path crossing and functions well.

Rekonn 06-09-2013 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdsester (Post 1197894)
Have you looked into distributed refrigeration at all? It is dropping in price and I think has even made it down to the level of perhaps special order from places like Sears.

Refrigerators date back to the designs for turn of the century ice boxes where one block of ice cooled everything. But when you think about it, doesn't it make more sense to put things like veges and meat in refrigerator drawers by the sink? And have a dedicated beverage frig just for soda, wine, beer or whatever elsewhere in the room and more accessible to the kids and so forth. As it is know, whenever someone reaches for a soda, the giant door swings open and 900,000cf of cool air blasts into the room and has to be cooled back down again.
...

Had no idea these existed, interesting!

Rekonn 06-09-2013 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Two Knots (Post 1197909)
Do you know what style cabs you want?
Do you know what type counter tops you
want?
What kind of appliances do you want?
...
We also took out the two by fours in back of the fridge,
and framed it out (like you would frame out a window) and the fridge fits
inside the frame ...thus, after we put compressed
fiberglass in the frame we picked up about 3".

The reason I mentioned this, as I have some thoughts
for a design for you, which includes taking out your
2 x 4's in back of the fridge.

Still brainstorming on overall look. My wife and I agree on granite counter tops and stainless steel appliances. I'm leaning towards white cabinets, my wife thinks a darker wood would match the house better. I'd like to nail down the layout first, style later.

Removing the 2x4's, resulting in a thinner exterior wall? I don't think I want to do that. If anything, I'll be taking advantage of this opportunity to make sure the walls have good insulation. MA winters can be pretty cold.

Rekonn 06-09-2013 10:17 AM

Saw a pic that inspired me. How about moving the range/stove into the corner to the left of the sink, and then moving the fridge to where the stove is now? Much better working triangle with that, no?

Still create wall where folding door entrance to mudroom is, remove wall of mudroom to create straight shot from foyer to mudroom exit.

Pic shows corner range just to get an idea.
http://st.houzz.com/simgs/b381aeae0f...al-kitchen.jpg


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