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Old 02-03-2010, 10:42 AM   #1
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Insulation between furring strips


I have an outside wall in an apartment that I am refurbishing that represents around 144 sq. feet of freezing cold. The plaster has failed down to the brown coat. I've decided to attach furring strips - 3/4" deep, and need to know what type of insulation to put between the strips before skinning over with the drywall. There is a product called Styro at a Big Box but it only has around R value of 4. Any suggestions about what to use would be greatly appreciated. BTW, should I put down a plastic barrier first?
Thanks.
Dick

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Old 02-03-2010, 10:50 AM   #2
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Insulation between furring strips


If you want proper insulation install at least 2" rigid for R10

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Old 02-03-2010, 11:04 AM   #3
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Insulation between furring strips


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Originally Posted by Scuba_Dave View Post
If you want proper insulation install at least 2" rigid for R10
I was hoping not to push the space out that far... This is a small efficiency apartment. 2" rigid would imply that I really almost need to frame out the wall...

Dick
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Old 02-03-2010, 04:22 PM   #4
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Insulation between furring strips


Remove the remaining plaster and put batts in the stud cavities. Putting furring strips over a brown coat makes no sense, especially if you also want to insulate the space.
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Old 02-03-2010, 08:46 PM   #5
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Insulation between furring strips


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Originally Posted by Ron6519 View Post
Remove the remaining plaster and put batts in the stud cavities. Putting furring strips over a brown coat makes no sense, especially if you also want to insulate the space.
Ron
Wish there were stud cavities.. What I'm looking at goes back to maybe the 1880's. I could be wrong, but I believe this outside wall is comprised of two layers of brick, lath, and three layers of plaster. It appears that someone attempted to reapply a thin coat in the 1920's or so, but I'm not absolutely sure about that. There isn't a stud in this entire building facing the outside.

This is a rental unit. I need to find a solution that isn't necessarily the best but gets me in and out in a reasonable amount of time and price wise. I decided to go with 5/4 furring strips and 1" Tuff-R that I got at the Box Store. For what it's worth, the R value of this stuff is between 5-6. Better than nothing which is what is there now. Plus, I deal with the cosmetic issues by covering the wall with drywall. Comments?

Dick

Last edited by RMCarner; 02-03-2010 at 09:20 PM.
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Old 02-03-2010, 09:19 PM   #6
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Insulation between furring strips


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Originally Posted by RMCarner View Post
Wish there were stud cavities.. What I'm looking at goes back to maybe the 1880's. I could be wrong, but I believe this outside wall is comprised of two layers of brick, lath, and three layers of plaster. It appears that someone attempted to reapply a thin coat in the 1920's or so, but I'm not absolutely sure about that. There isn't a stud in this entire building facing the outside.
Correction: I know now that there is no lath. Rather what I have are 3 coats - a render layer, a floating layer, and a setting layer. Deterioration is evident all the way down and into the render layer. Fossil fuel was so cheap back then, I guess you could get away without any insulation to speak of.

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Old 02-03-2010, 11:00 PM   #7
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Insulation between furring strips


R-5 outside sheathing on an empty wall if in Lancaster, PA: http://www.ornl.gov/sci/roofs+walls/...on/ins_16.html

The inspector may buy it. If you could leave an air space------- (2) System R-value is the sum of the product R-value plus additional R-value calculated when the aluminum foil surface is installed next to a non-ventilated 3/4" air space (R-value = 2.8). http://www.dow.com/PublishedLiteratu...romPage=GetDoc

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Old 02-04-2010, 08:25 AM   #8
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Insulation between furring strips


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R-5 outside sheathing on an empty wall if in Lancaster, PA: http://www.ornl.gov/sci/roofs+walls/...on/ins_16.html
Very useful source. Thanks.

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The inspector may buy it. If you could leave an air space-------
Not following you here. The plan (not absolutely set in concrete yet..) was to attached the furring strips to the existing plaster then cut the Tuff-R to fit - shiny side toward the outside. Then cover with sheetrock. In the link you provided above I found the following statement: "It is sometimes feasible to install rigid insulation on the outdoor side of masonry sidewalls such as concrete block or poured concrete.However, if that is not an option, you can use rigid insulation boards or batts to insulate the interior of masonry walls. To install boards, wood furring strips should be fastened to the wall first. These strips provide a nailing base for attaching interior finishes over the insulation. Fire safety codes require that a gypsum board finish, at least 1/2 inch thick, be placed over plastic foam insulation. The gypsum board must be attached to the wood furring strips or underlying masonry using nails or screws."

Quote:
(2) System R-value is the sum of the product R-value plus additional R-value calculated when the aluminum foil surface is installed next to a non-ventilated 3/4
Quote:
" air space (R-value = 2.8). http://www.dow.com/PublishedLiteratu...romPage=GetDoc
If I get your drift, what you seem to be saying is that I am going to take a hit on the effective R-value if I do not somehow include an airspace. How do I do that without at the same time losing touch with my original goal, which was to minimize space lose? Lancaster has more old buildings per capita than any other city in the US. I know of several contractors that use this technique if they are constrained by a budgetary process. I dunno, I'm all ears for other ideas, but I am also constrained that way as well. Thanks.

Dick
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Old 02-05-2010, 12:26 AM   #9
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Insulation between furring strips


What I meant was, check with your local building department for the required R-value. If they will accept what you have planned, as the foil is vapor impermeable (0.003): http://www.ornl.gov/sci/roofs+walls/...papers/143.pdf http://fire.nist.gov/bfrlpubs/build96/PDF/b96086.pdf


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Old 02-05-2010, 07:25 AM   #10
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Insulation between furring strips


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Originally Posted by GBR in WA View Post
What I meant was, check with your local building department for the required R-value. If they will accept what you have planned, as the foil is vapor impermeable (0.003): http://www.ornl.gov/sci/roofs+walls/...papers/143.pdf http://fire.nist.gov/bfrlpubs/build96/PDF/b96086.pdf
Okay, Gary Thanks.
Dick

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