Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Remodeling

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 01-24-2011, 07:20 PM   #1
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Southeastern Massachusetts
Posts: 106
Share |
Default

gutting bathroom


Hi - I'm gutting a full bathroom in my 1940s home. Been quite an experience so far. Mummified mice, old Chesterfield cigarette packs and me knicking a water supply line with my sawzall to name a few interesting things. I have a lot of questions, but I'll start with only a couple.

Heating - I had a 2 ft section of radiator in the corner of the bathroom. I've been thinking of something less intrusive to replace it with. I was thinking of replacing it with a couple sections of Slant Fin series 80, which would wrap around an inside corner. The bathroom is 6 x 4', not including tub space, which wouldn't require that much heat. Does anyone have any other suggestions?

Electrical - I'm going to run a new 20A circuit that includes a GFCI outlet in this bathroom and also in our half bath downstairs. Is it OK to power bathroom lighting and the vent fan on this circuit? In one of the photos you can see an outlet for the adjacent bedroom. I assume it's not code to power this outlet on the bathroom circuit? The outlet is currently fed from the light/fan, but isn't grounded, so I was thinking of re-wiring that outlet so the bedroom has at least one grounded outlet.

Insulation - The exterior bathroom wall has insulation, but it is probably original. While the wall is open, should I just replace it? I also noticed remnants of insulation between the floor joists. Should I put insulation in between the joists?
Attached Thumbnails
gutting bathroom-img_4592.jpg   gutting bathroom-img_4595.jpg  

debiasio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2011, 07:02 AM   #2
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 3,118
Default

gutting bathroom


Bet that was fun.........all mud tile, concrete floor. I did a late 40's bathrom couple of years ago, 9x6, took out 6200lbs of tile, plaster, cement.

Replace as much of the 1 1/2 or 2" galvanized drain as practical.

One 20A circuit required for the GFCI outlet, cannot power the lighting/fan. Use the old circuit for lighting, and run a new for outlet.

Tear out any old insulation, install full thick batts/rolls, and add plastic vapor barrier.

Just Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2011, 09:41 AM   #3
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Southeastern Massachusetts
Posts: 106
Default

gutting bathroom


>>Bet that was fun.........all mud tile, concrete floor. I did a late 40's bathrom couple of years ago, 9x6, took out 6200lbs of tile, plaster, cement.

I couldn't believe how thick the mud was. They really built things to last back then.


>>Tear out any old insulation, install full thick batts/rolls, and add plastic vapor barrier.

Is there any need to put insulation between the floor joists?

>>One 20A circuit required for the GFCI outlet, cannot power the lighting/fan. Use the old circuit for lighting, and run a new for outlet.

I don't have enough breakers to have the GFCIs separated...so they'll need to be on the same circuit. I'll deal with the hair-dryer problem later, or maybe I'll have all boys

If anyone is familiar with connecting Slant-Fin baseboard to an existing steam supply, I'd appreciate some help. The guy at my local plumbing/heating supply store said it couldn't be done, but I thought Slant-Fin makes a model that hooks up to steam.
debiasio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2011, 07:51 AM   #4
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 3,118
Default

gutting bathroom


Insulation in the floor usually a waste of time, unless there is a crawl space under.

Not a heat pro, so can't help with that. There are modern radiators that can equal the output of an old cast iron, check with a plumbing supplier.

Check local electrical code for what is required. Even if you do it, it has to be inspected.
Just Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2011, 09:30 AM   #5
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 9,519
Default

gutting bathroom


I'd lose the Slant fin idea and put in a recessed convection radiator. If you want a baseboard heat, put in a cast iron baseboard unit. Something that will hold the heat. The other baseboard will cool off too quickly to keep the room warm.
If you need more breakers, put in a subpanel so you can properly run your electric. Doing it half assed makes no sense.
Ron
Ron6519 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2011, 10:04 AM   #6
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Albany, NY
Posts: 71
Default

gutting bathroom


You don't mention where you are located, but if it's somewhere cold, I would foam the walls.

You can buy a 200 cubic foam tank for about $280. That would be plenty to do the bathroom walls and celing to 3.5" and likely have some left over to put under the floor. No need for a vapor barrier afterwards. Note: Don't foam directly to a recessed light (if you are putting any in)--you have to leave some space for heat dissipation.

If you don't have enough room for two GFCIs, then you should probably have a new panel put in (probably $700 - $1000) if you already have 200 AMP panel.

20 AMP GFCI for the outlet (I don't know why girls have to use a hair dryer AND a curling iron at the same time, but whatever...)

Separate 15 AMP for the ceiling fan/light (which will avoid the annoying problem of the lights flickering when you turn on a device at the outlet).

Always run new wiring when remodeling an old house.

Have you considered radiant heat? Electrical is easiest, but wet could be an option.

Have considered replacing your old water lines with PEX? Old water lines usually have junk buildup that reduces water flow/pressure.

Finally, why not replace the cast iron drain lines with PVC? The drain lines are likely 60+ years old. Gonna break someday if not replaced.

Last edited by toddmanqa; 01-26-2011 at 10:06 AM.
toddmanqa is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to toddmanqa For This Useful Post:
atxjoe (02-11-2011)
Old 01-28-2011, 09:27 AM   #7
Newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: ****off
Posts: 25
Default

gutting bathroom


I agree with toddmanqa for the Electric Radiant Heat. The coils come in a variety of sizes, and you can get a thermostat that will turn on and warm up the bathroom floor before get up in the morning--it doesn't make sense to use the Slant-fin type heating when Electric Radiant Heat will do so much more for you, i.e. save wall space, & no hot spots. When I was in England years ago, they even had heated towel bars, now that felt good on a chilly morning!
Tangelo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2011, 06:49 AM   #8
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Southeastern Massachusetts
Posts: 106
Default

gutting bathroom


I live in Massachusetts. I've never heard of foaming walls. Is this significantly better than adding new fiberglass insulation?

I have a 100A panel and I am maxed out on breakers. Up until now I've been able to abandon wires in the wall (dead on both ends of course) and run new wiring. I have one breaker earmarked to run a new 20A circuit with two.

Radiant heat sounds interesting but they require yet another dedicated circuit. I think I need to start thinking about a subpanel...is that a DIY project?

The old sink had great water pressure, so I don't think I need to replace the supply lines.

Do you mean replace the cast iron soil pipe all the way to the stack? Will think about that too. If it's not a DIY project, then I may have to pass, as money is a limiting factor.
debiasio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2011, 07:50 AM   #9
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 9,519
Default

gutting bathroom


Quote:
Originally Posted by debiasio View Post
I live in Massachusetts. I've never heard of foaming walls. Is this significantly better than adding new fiberglass insulation?

I have a 100A panel and I am maxed out on breakers. Up until now I've been able to abandon wires in the wall (dead on both ends of course) and run new wiring. I have one breaker earmarked to run a new 20A circuit with two.

Radiant heat sounds interesting but they require yet another dedicated circuit. I think I need to start thinking about a subpanel...is that a DIY project?

The old sink had great water pressure, so I don't think I need to replace the supply lines.

Do you mean replace the cast iron soil pipe all the way to the stack? Will think about that too. If it's not a DIY project, then I may have to pass, as money is a limiting factor.
Adding a subpanel can be DIY, if you know what you're doing, or know someone who knows what they're doing.
Good water pressure is not an indication the pipes need changing or do not need changing. It's their age.
Changing the iron pipes to pvc requires a hacksaw and a screwdriver and a careful touch when you get near the toilet.
All the things you want to avoid doing because of cost or experience will bite you in the ass in the long run. You'll end up tearing up the bathroom to get to the things you're now avoiding.
Ron
Ron6519 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-08-2011, 06:45 PM   #10
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Southeastern Massachusetts
Posts: 106
Default

gutting bathroom


Do in-wall or baseboard heaters located in bathrooms need to be GFCI protected? The in-wall heater I am looking at says it has to be, but was thinking it was more CYA than following electrical code.
debiasio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2011, 04:00 PM   #11
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 186
Default

gutting bathroom


I was reading this post and just had to ask. I am no electrician but I am planning to remodel my bathroom and on this forum I was told one circuit was fine to run GFCI outlet, fan and lights as long as it is dedicated to just the bathroom and nothing else. I was told to Reference 210.11(C)(3), exception.

Is that not correct?
zephed666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2011, 08:15 PM   #12
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 9,519
Default

gutting bathroom


Quote:
Originally Posted by zephed666 View Post
I was reading this post and just had to ask. I am no electrician but I am planning to remodel my bathroom and on this forum I was told one circuit was fine to run GFCI outlet, fan and lights as long as it is dedicated to just the bathroom and nothing else. I was told to Reference 210.11(C)(3), exception.

Is that not correct?
I always run 2 circuits to the bathroom. If the GFCI trips the outlet, I don't want the bathroon to go dark.
Ron
Ron6519 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2011, 07:36 AM   #13
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 186
Default

gutting bathroom


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron6519 View Post
I always run 2 circuits to the bathroom. If the GFCI trips the outlet, I don't want the bathroon to go dark.
Ron

But it is not required by code correct? Especially in a small bathroom. Why not run the lights first then the GFCI outlet so if the GFCI trips the lights stay on?
zephed666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2011, 07:44 AM   #14
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 86
Default

gutting bathroom


Can't you just go to the gfci outlet first, just have a big enough box to pigtail of the line to the outlet?!?!?
gilbo125 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2011, 08:00 AM   #15
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 9,519
Default

gutting bathroom


Quote:
Originally Posted by zephed666 View Post
But it is not required by code correct? Especially in a small bathroom. Why not run the lights first then the GFCI outlet so if the GFCI trips the lights stay on?
No, it's not required by code. I just do it that way. I can run a 12-3 just as easily as a 12-2. I put the whole bath on GFCI's. The lights and fan are on a GFCI breaker and the receptacle is a GFCI.
Ron

Ron6519 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Basement bathroom rough in efrobert Plumbing 2 06-23-2011 04:54 PM
Bathroom DWV Layout Problems grymes56 Plumbing 8 05-15-2011 09:00 AM
Bathroom fan replacement reveals...a mess merlanvp Electrical 0 07-25-2010 08:00 PM
Basement bathroom wiring mess. Little help. trailblazer1229 Electrical 15 02-16-2010 09:29 AM
Started gutting my bathroom today... Mantaray14 Remodeling 6 11-24-2009 08:48 AM




Top of Page | View New Posts

Copyright © 2003-2014 Escalate Media. All Rights Reserved.