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-   -   Cathedral ceiling, opening ceiling (http://www.diychatroom.com/f15/cathedral-ceiling-opening-ceiling-66484/)

Blackwater 03-10-2010 02:08 PM

Cathedral ceiling, opening ceiling
 
This is a addition on the back side of the house that is the kitchen. I want to raise the ceiling, basically drywalling up to the peak with support/cross beams showing.
With how this is build can move the beams one by and go every other in order moving them higher. I was thinking if doubling them on every beam in 4 foot lengths which would give me 10 inches of clearance from top of beam to peak of ceiling. Then reinforcing the beam where they meet at the wall, holding any movement that might happen from moving the cross beams.
Sorry, wish I had the technical words for stuff but still learning!

I dont know why the beams are cut and the new support was put in. It wasnt done by me. I removed the rest of that drywall in photo and there is no reason for it being there. It just continues the beams on the other side.

http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w...t/101_2770.jpg
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w...t/101_2766.jpg

And here is a few before shots for you. And no more leaks, put on a new roof.
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w...t/101_2736.jpg
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w...t/101_2735.jpg

Scuba_Dave 03-10-2010 02:46 PM

Joists running across hold the walls together, keeps roof weight from spreading the walls out
Whoever cut them may have already caused a problem
I *think* they need to be located in the bottom 1/3 of the rafter
So if the rafter is 9' long you could move them up 3' along the rafter
NOT 3' straight up
This can also depend upon the rafter sizes & roof slope

Other option is to put a ridge BEAM in that will properly support the roof at the ridge

Roof framing can be problematic...especiialy if your rafters are undersized
So...size of room, - rafter span ?

oldfrt 03-10-2010 03:38 PM

It looks like a bearing wall was probably removed at some
point in the vicinity of where those joists(beams in OP)
were cut.
The newer lumber,where the joist hangers are attached, was installed to carry the load weight
of the ceiling joists to the exterior walls.
It looks a little undersized for the span here with today's codes,
but may be adequate if the joists no longer hang off it.

As far as moving the joists into a collar tie position,
I'd check with the local building inspector,or get something engineered.
Since you haven't posted your location,the roof load will depend on
whether snow/wind will be a factor.

Blackwater 03-11-2010 12:46 AM

Thanks, I have to wonder how you got what I saying. I was a little sleepy writing that! Lol

Oldfrt.
There was a wall there at one time with the door. From where the was to where it is now was a mud room. When you say “Load weight” are you referring that the wall was holding the weight of the joist before they were cut? Since the wall was removed that support beam takes the walls place?

Scuba Dave,
What do you mean by ridge beam? From the way you put it, if I do that then no joist are need?

Scuba_Dave 03-11-2010 07:38 AM

A ridge beam goes at the peak & supports the roof rafters
This keeps them from exerting weight down which would spread the walls
When I planned my walk up attic I had them design the space as a cathedral ceiling without rafter ties

I ended up going with rafter ties, spanning ~24' I would have needed (3) 16" LVL's

You would need to have a beam engineered/designed to carry the load

oldfrt 03-11-2010 09:10 AM

Quote:

Since the wall was removed that support beam takes the walls place?
Yes,and Scuba Dave has a great idea with the ridge beam which could be
set under the existing ridge.

Blackwater 03-12-2010 01:36 AM

I did some homework and this is what I came up with and have started. Let me know if Im on the right path.

Oh Oldfrt, Im in Maryland.

And Scuba Dave, The room size is 9x18...

I got other issues too that are not shown in the photos above.

I have 6 joist which are floating and 2 that are against the walls. Then 2 short rafters over the existing roof. You can see in photo.
Going on info scuba dave gave me and what I found online this is where Im at.
I put collar ties at 3 feet up along the rafter. A hair higher though. I found you can go every 3rd rafter leaving 2 rafters in the middle of the ties.
If you look at the second photo, act like you are the one taking the picture. To the right the new wood support beam is resting on a box that was built around a chimney. Where that chimney is the rafter was cut and placed onto the chimney. With this in mind I had to pick where my collar ties would work best which you can see in the photo.
I reinforced the ridge column on the outside wall sandwiching some 2x4s. The one in the middle was there and I added the 2 on each side snugged up on the rafter hoping this will help with ridge load. I did this for temp till I pull the cabinets. I will continue that to the foundation. The joist that was against the wall I have pulled down and will reinstall a new on since it was cut. On the other side I havent done yet but I am going to put a column there to the ridge beam. Inside the wall is already beefed up so I shouldn't have to continue that down.
Now the chimney area. Im going to cut the one rafter running into the chimney to fit 2 2x6s to the full rafters on either side. Im going to do this again on the lower side then connect the 2 cross beams mini rafters that will frame the chimney plus helping when hanging drywall. From the support column that will be on the side with the chimney i will go out left and right. Im going to stud 16 o.c. thus again hoping to take more load.
Then I was going to do short collar tie on the rafter up near where it connects to the old roof.

Will the combination of using 2 methods be enough. I cant add any beef to the ridge beam without ripping the roof apart “i think” but added more load strength to the ends. Since that ridge beam cant hold much i put in the collar ties.

Blackwater 03-12-2010 01:50 AM

http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w...t/100_2833.jpg
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w...t/100_2832.jpg
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w...t/100_2835.jpg
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w...t/100_2838.jpg

Blackwater 03-12-2010 02:08 AM

How do you like that electrical set up ? I found it that way just sitting on the top side of the old ceiling UNDER insulation....scary!

I plan on chipping plaster and crud off of the chimney and leaving it exposed. Should amount to be a good time! Lol

That PVC is the vent for the water. What do you call it? I am going to move it within the wall left of the chimney. Doing it like that I would run it straight up and out the roof and patching the hole it is in now. Do these have to be a certain diameter? Do they have to go to the roof top or can I run it to the side of the house?


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