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Old 08-30-2010, 08:35 AM   #1
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


Hi, thanks for reading.PLease see the pic/diagram in my following post.

1.on the 1st floor of my 3 storey 3-plex building, I need to change the back patio door. The existing patio door is about 52" wide and the smallest standard door is 60". After opening up the cover of the frame, I need to expand the rough opening by at least 6". Now here is the problem:

as of now, both sides of the door's rough opening is right on the 3"X12" vertical solid studs. (all the exterior walls are built with stacked logs)

The esst stud is in the middle of the wall; The west stud may go all the way up till the 3 floor as it is the west corner of the building. The west stud also ends within an stell/iron vertical I beam, which is for the first floor used-to-be commercial space.

So, i need 6" out of the existing opening with the 2 big studs. Can I just cut into the both studs as they are 3" X12", which seems over engineered for today's standard? Or can I just cut into the studs and use a robust steel structure hardware to bult it in and keep the integraty?

2. East of the patio door is the existing one storey garage with no windeows. I want to put windows in and again, i need a rough opening bigger than what I can have with two 3"X12" studs to the both ends. I need also an extra 3" or 4" out of it. What do i do?

Thanks a lot

Last edited by hohadcr; 09-01-2010 at 01:03 PM.
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Old 08-30-2010, 08:46 AM   #2
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


Have you considered having someone like Jen-Weld make make you a 52" replacement?
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Last edited by Michael Thomas; 08-30-2010 at 05:26 PM.
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Old 08-30-2010, 04:04 PM   #3
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


we are up in Quebec. to make a patio door custom made will cost a lot $$$. We are doing it for the lowest budget... and trying to do everything ourselves.

Any ideas for the studs?
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Old 08-30-2010, 04:27 PM   #4
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


A picture is worth a thousand words.
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Old 08-30-2010, 09:27 PM   #5
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


Please see attachment.

Can i

1. Cut into the 12" wide studs to get the 6"?
2. instead of adding jack studs for the new header, add a metal structral piece to gain the load bearing capability and save space?
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steel plate instead of king jacks?-backdoor.jpg  
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Old 09-01-2010, 01:03 PM   #6
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


anyone can help?
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Old 09-01-2010, 01:34 PM   #7
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


Well if Im reading the drawing correctly, I would build a temporary wall before you cut anything out. Then cut out your required opening and place a steel beam across the opening and add (2) 4 square steel columns on either side to carry the load. But I would have to be there to actually see the situation to give you a better idea.
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Old 09-01-2010, 01:52 PM   #8
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


Reducing the stud widths of a log spline wall at the bottom of a three story wall to widen the door opening could prove dangerous. I suggest consulting a log house engineer through a log house builder for the required solution. It may involve changing the shear flow of the wall or racking resistance. It was designed and engineered the existing way. You need a design and engineering to change it, on paper for your H.O.Insurance carrier for liability. You may be able to do some of the work yourself, maybe not for the liability involved. Let us know how it turns out......

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Old 09-09-2010, 09:44 AM   #9
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


Is there any text book talking about the load-bearing issue? Would it say if the king jacks (usually wooden studs) can be replaced by steel beams that save spaces? Would there be a chart or something?

Also, would there be any rules about haveing an opening in the middle of the load-bearing beams?
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Old 09-09-2010, 09:54 AM   #10
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The only person that could give you the right answer for your situation is a structural engineer. The books and tables are only used as a guide but the calculations are always different for each situation.
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Old 09-09-2010, 01:59 PM   #11
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


Maybe I'm missing something here, but all this steel structual beams/books/engineers will probally add up more than that custom sized door
previously mentioned.
You don't count all that time you'll take doing all that cutting & crap as money....... just to get 6 inches.
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Old 09-10-2010, 09:33 AM   #12
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


Hi, thanks for reading.PLease see the pic/diagram for reference.

(This is a follow-up post with better developed thoughts with all of yours help.)

on the 1st floor of my 3 storey 3-plex building, I need to widen the existing door frame. as of now, both sides of the door's rough opening is right on the 3"X12" vertical solid studs. (all the exterior walls are built with stacked logs). The esst stud(shown in the pic as the right side one) is in the middle of the wall; The west(left) stud may go all the way up till the 3 floor as it is the west corner of the building. The west stud also ends within an stell/iron vertical I beam, which is for the first floor used-to-be commercial space.


After some thought, I would like to keep the right side beam as is, and get the opening widened on the left hand side. My plan now is to openup the left side, and put a header and do the king jacks as all others do for load-bearing walls.

My question is: for the right hand side, can I use a steel structure to tie the header into the exist beam instead of putting king studs as normal practice?


Thanks a lot
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Old 09-10-2010, 10:13 AM   #13
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


You have a one off type project, very unusual framing, plus it involves mixed steel and wooden framing. You are not going to find any useful information in standard framing texts. Given that this is a three story building, with potentially heavy loading, you absolutely need to hire a structural engineer to work out the details of the framing, connections, header, and temporary support required during the project. Plus you almost certainly need a building permit, which will likely require a stamped drawing from an engineer.
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Old 09-10-2010, 03:35 PM   #14
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


Hi, thanks for reading.PLease see the pic/diagram for reference.

(This is a follow-up post with better developed thoughts with all of yours help.)

on the 1st floor of my 3 storey 3-plex building, I need to widen the existing door frame. as of now, both sides of the door's rough opening is right on the 3"X12" vertical solid studs. (all the exterior walls are built with stacked logs). The esst stud(shown in the pic as the right side one) is in the middle of the wall; The west(left) stud may go all the way up till the 3 floor as it is the west corner of the building. The west stud also ends within an stell/iron vertical I beam, which is for the first floor used-to-be commercial space.


After some thought, I would like to keep the right side beam as is, and get the opening widened on the left hand side. My plan now is to openup the left side, and put a header and do the king jacks as all others do for load-bearing walls.

My question is: for the right hand side, can I use a steel structure to tie the header into the exist beam instead of putting king studs as normal practice?
Attached Thumbnails
steel plate instead of king jacks?-1912-back-door.jpg  
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Old 09-10-2010, 04:40 PM   #15
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steel plate instead of king jacks?


3 threads on the same issue merged
Thanks
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