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rubicon789 01-24-2007 06:11 PM

Insulation under kitchen addition
 
We recently purchased a home in NJ and the previous owners had put on a kitchen addition. The addition was completed with a block foundation which is accessable through the old basement window. Since this is our first winter with the home we notice that the kitchen is extremly cold. Much colder then the rest of the house. So I inspected the crawl space under the kitchen and sure enough, NO INSULATION... Gues that the rest it feels like we are standing on ice.

My Question is... What type of insulation should I put in the floor joists? Should I also cover the entire thing in plastic for vapor? ANy help will be greatly appreciated, I would like to get this done tomorrow or Fri and will be doing it myself.

billinak 01-24-2007 06:38 PM

I'm pretty sure you don't want to insulate under the floor. What you want to do is insulate the footer walls to keep the crawlspace warmer altogether, but you definitley do not want a vapor barrier that can trap moisture and wreck your floor. Someone more knowledgeable than myself should be along shorly....

rubicon789 01-24-2007 07:43 PM

Ok good point... the footer walls are not insulated either.. So you guy's would suggest only insulating that portion? What type of insulation would you use?

Thanks Billnak

AtlanticWBConst. 01-24-2007 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubicon789 (Post 31147)
We recently purchased a home in NJ and the previous owners had put on a kitchen addition. The addition was completed with a block foundation which is accessable through the old basement window. Since this is our first winter with the home we notice that the kitchen is extremly cold. Much colder then the rest of the house. So I inspected the crawl space under the kitchen and sure enough, NO INSULATION... Gues that the rest it feels like we are standing on ice.

My Question is... What type of insulation should I put in the floor joists? Should I also cover the entire thing in plastic for vapor? ANy help will be greatly appreciated, I would like to get this done tomorrow or Fri and will be doing it myself.


Most cost effective and moisture proof:

Use ridgid foam insulation (Thick Pink or foil covered) Yes, you can cover this type of foam insualtion with a poly vapor barrier.

Brik 01-25-2007 10:44 AM

You CAN insulate the floors. I would do that if the following is true:
-The crawl space is vented
-There are no pipes in the area that will not be insulated
-There are no heating ducts that aren't, or cant be insulated.

The thing with insulating the walls of the space is you are then heating/cooling the crawl space essentially. It becomes part of your conditioned space.

If you insulate the floors and have pipes outside the conditioned space they are more likely to freeze.

If I had pipes to deal with I would try and locate them up tight to the underside of the floor so I could insulate the floor. Supply that's easy. Drains are trickier.

If I had ducts I would insulate them, regardless.

here is a acticle on the subject (from a mfg)
http://www.owenscorning.com/around/i...ect/floors.asp

and
http://www.owenscorning.com/around/i...ationwalls.asp

rubicon789 01-25-2007 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brik (Post 31197)
You CAN insulate the floors. I would do that if the following is true:
-The crawl space is vented
-There are no pipes in the area that will not be insulated
-There are no heating ducts that aren't, or cant be insulated.

The thing with insulating the walls of the space is you are then heating/cooling the crawl space essentially. It becomes part of your conditioned space.

If you insulate the floors and have pipes outside the conditioned space they are more likely to freeze.

If I had pipes to deal with I would try and locate them up tight to the underside of the floor so I could insulate the floor. Supply that's easy. Drains are trickier.

If I had ducts I would insulate them, regardless.

here is a acticle on the subject (from a mfg)
http://www.owenscorning.com/around/i...ect/floors.asp

and
http://www.owenscorning.com/around/i...ationwalls.asp

Thanks so much for the info... thats a bigt help. As for the crawl space being vented. I am not sure, I am going to crawl all around tomorrow, should there be a vent of some kind. Also the pipe thing... there are a few supply lines and a sink drain line. The supply line is insulated but only with a very thin cover like a bicycle bar padding, and it is also up in the floor joists. The drain is not, so your saying that I should just insulate the drain pipe as well as the floor. Not to worry about the walls then. I don't want to leave the crawl space open b/c it is only accessable through the old basement window from inside the home. The kitchen they built was just added to the back of the home. It just seems like a place for bugs and crap to get in easier. Thanks for the help.

AtlanticWBConst. 01-25-2007 08:41 PM

For what it's worth:

The Avatar picture in my profile is an addition that we built on a concrete foundation that is essentially a crawl space (36" ht) recently finished on outskirts of Boston, MA

The water heating lines (pipes) are inside the floor joist cavities and the cavities are filled with icynene insulation (Spray foam)

The pipes are thus insulated. The foundation has a vent on one side and 2 windows on the other to allow for cross-ventilation. This ventilation is really for moist hot air in during warmer months - to exit.

During winter, you do not need to ventilate the crawl space. In fact, it should be closed up.

PS: The ventilation - is a code requirement in my area for crawl spaces. In fact there is an equation used to figure out the minimum vent size required per the SF of the crawl space dimensions.

rubicon789 01-25-2007 09:35 PM

Thanks for the info.. I will check some of that stuff out tomorrow. FOr some reason though I don't remember seeing a ventilation duct of any kind... That seems strange b/c it would only make sense to have of especially for gases to exit... I am going to have to check with our county code b/c maybe they missed something when they did their township inspection. Thanks again.

Brik 01-26-2007 09:09 AM

For vetalation there is NOT likely a duct. Just an openening. Usually the size of one concrete block with or without a grate on it.

rubicon789 01-26-2007 09:19 AM

I looked no openings at all it is all closed in. The only access to it is throught the old basement window which is inside the house now. SHould

rubicon789 01-26-2007 09:20 AM

I looked no openings at all it is all closed in. The only access to it is throught the old basement window which is inside the house now. Should I worry if I insulate? I mean the addition was built in 1989 so no problems i guess as of now. It is just so darn cold in there.

AtlanticWBConst. 01-26-2007 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubicon789 (Post 31299)
I looked no openings at all it is all closed in. The only access to it is throught the old basement window which is inside the house now. Should I worry if I insulate? I mean the addition was built in 1989 so no problems i guess as of now. It is just so darn cold in there.

Should be fine if you use foam insulation.

Tho, there should be still be some way to allow the crawl space area to 'breath' out moist/humid air in the summertime.


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