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Justahome 04-03-2009 07:14 PM

Extend House Roof Over Back Deck
 
6 Attachment(s)
Hi all...It's my first post and I'm hoping someone can lend their expertise in my "roof over deck" project. I buyilt a deck last year with intention of asdding the roof this summer. The problem? Is anyone familiar with the Canadian Westcoast term, "Vancouver Special" in relation to a design of home? It's a pretty ugy and very basic home design built as slab on grade.

The reason...I want the original roof to extend over this deck without a peak so that I can maximize the earlier afternoon sunshine from the South exposure on that side. I don't want the standard aluminum and glass roof that is so common here and is frankly, unsightly in my humble opinion.

I have pics and will try to send them so it's pretty self-explainatory but obviously there will be many questions.

I have 2 equally important concerns that I'm seeking guidance on...

1. The design of this roof needs to compliment the house.

2. The structure should be "over-engineered" because I have not pulled a permit...want it absolutely safe (if not too late for that already based on the current structure I've put up to support it)!

The deck faces south when coming out the door with the early afternoon sun on our left so this is where I want the roof to be as high as the original...no peak. The rain run-off will be on the right side (east side) , same as the original roof and an exposed gutter along this end.

I know many will design a smaller "peaked" roof to compliment the original but this would take away more sun and bring the roof lower which I don't want. So it looks like I need to simply attach a "one-sided" roof so-to-speak to attach by a ledger board right next to my original roof? I want the deck roof to be 1/2 as wide as my original roof basically. I need to know my material size.

The furthest 3 posts are set in the ground on 1 1/2' x 1 1/2' footings (blocks) plus a smaller peer on top of that. Under the deck is a foundation that is almost the same size as the deck with the rest of the posts sitting on the foundation as pictured.

I have more pics of the deck before covered so you can see the structure in detail.

I hope I've given enough info to start.

Thanks everyone!

Hmmm...not sure my first pics got attached?

Scuba_Dave 04-03-2009 07:20 PM

Is this new construction?
Or you want a roof over that white deck?

If not post a pic that show the roof angle & deck from the side & front

Justahome 04-03-2009 07:31 PM

6 Attachment(s)
I've been trying to ad the original pics of the new deck to my original thread but am having trouble. Hope this works. I deleted the extra thread of the same name. Not sure if it'll work. Here goes...

Five Star 04-03-2009 07:32 PM

it looks like you got it going good. find the pitch of you existing roof, put a header on those posts, figure out the rise,make a template rafter with the birds mouth and over hangs and start setting rafters,should be a nice weekend project

Justahome 04-03-2009 07:48 PM

Thanks. What's a birds mouth? Some things I'm assuming...the new east end beam will sit on top of the east posts due to the existing beam (which I will butt into and attach with a nice big tee plate or something fabricated due to some finishing detail). But the west side I'm not too sure about...The existing beam on the house is the top peak and the support posts are staggered from that beam so again, I assume I need to install a new beam there 90 degrees to the house? Maybe a 2x10 or 2x12 (not sure of size either but thought I would match for esthetics) on each side of the posts or somethin'? It needs to be bolted to the west posts so it's secure, correct? I dunno. The underside will be finished in T&G cedar or something nice to hide everything. Like the cladding of the posts I'll dio similar to the beams...particularly this west beam. The rafters will run E-W.

Five Star 04-03-2009 07:54 PM

it looks like in your other post you have 6x6 so why not notch those to seat a header then bolt it together for a permenent connection, a birds mouth is a seat and plumb cut you will need to make for a good connection between the headers.

Justahome 04-03-2009 08:03 PM

The pics of the finished deck were sent with another thread of the same name and I've been trying to attach to the original but can't figure out yet...don't have any time now time now...will attach them to this original thread once (and if) I figure out how...sorry for the confusion.

Five Star?---the posts are 3/4" cedar cladded 4x4's. (Just made to look bigger!)

Five Star 04-03-2009 08:04 PM

Lay it out with a framing square.
Cut it almost all the way (don't over-cut the line on either side) with a skill (circular) saw.
Finish both cuts with either a Sabre Saw (Jig Saw) or a Sawzall, or as I do, simply a good hand saw. Takes about a minute or less with a hand saw.

There are three basic cuts used in creating the rafter; the plumb cut at the top of the rafter where it fits against the ridge plate; the tail cut that creates the outside edge of the building eaves; and the bird's mouth, which positions the rafter on the top of the wall plate.

Hold the framing square with the manufacturer's name up; this is called the “face” of the square, and the opposite side is the “back.” The long arm of the square is the “blade,” and the short arm is the “tongue.”

In this example we'll use a 1/3 pitch as shown in the drawing below, this means a rise of 8 inches for each 12 inches of run (an 8/12 pitch roof).

The first step is to lay the square on the edge of the rafter board and locate 8 inches on the tongue (the rise), and 12 inches on the blade (the unit of run). All on the same side of the framing square. Measure from the point on the blade to the point on the tongue—it should be 14-7/16 inches. Multiply this by the run of the building. We're using 10 feet in this example, excluding the overhang. The resulting figure is 144-3/8 inches. (14.4375 x 10=144.375 or 14 3/8") We add 12 inches for the overhang to get a final figure of 156-3/8 inches.

Now, what this means in simple terms is this. You know that it takes a longer piece of wood to run up the slope of a roof than it does to simply lay flat across the floor. Shucks you can look up and plainly see that. But how much longer? That's where (in this case) you use the 14-7/16" you figured out with the distance between the two framing square measurements.

For every 12 inches a board stretches across the floor, (in this case 10 of those 12" increments since it's 10' feet across) it would take 14-7/16" running up a slope to cover the same level distance.

Of course, the steeper the roof, the longer the slanted (rake) length of wood would be required to cover that same 12" across the floor. Conversely, the lower the rake (closer to level and flat) the shorter the measurement would be till it eventually returned to 12" again when the wood was again laying on the floor.

Here's a tip that may help your visualization while laying out rafters: The only cuts used on a common rafter are the plumb and level... and maybe on a cheap job, a square cut on the end.
Attached Imageshttp://www.diychatroom.com/attachmen...299-x-280-.jpg

Justahome 04-03-2009 08:12 PM

Thanks Five Star...You have a name I can use? . Mine's Lori. You would make a good instructor... Appreciated! Gonna drive home now and get back to this tomorrow. Have a nice evening!

Five Star 04-03-2009 08:15 PM

thanks lori, im Nathan..have a good ride home and keep on smiling, its not as hard as it sounds. your half way there. pm me if you have any questions

Ron6519 04-03-2009 10:07 PM

Lori, from what I've seen of the deck construction, I would not put a roof on it. It doesn't look like it will stand the weight.The vertical posts don't seem to have any connection to the deck itself except the posts nearest the house. The post bases look like there just sitting on the concrete. The ones on those little concrete blocks seem to be off center with some sort of Teco connectors dangling off the side of the block.
If the roof is built like the deck, it will collapse and kill somebody.
This structure needs to be looked at by someone knowledgeable before you continue.
Ron

Scuba_Dave 04-03-2009 10:20 PM

1st

Go get a permit
Since if they don't like what you have already done they may make you rip it down or modify it

Justahome 04-04-2009 01:21 PM

You could just ask, Ron...the 9 posts are all connected to the piers or foundation in some fashion using the required galvanised, dble dipped coatings and connectors recommended by the manufacturer, not to go into details here. Those connectors were just sitting there in a pile or next to the posts. The posts weren't connected in the photo at that time. All bottom plates on the structure below are also hitied down to the foundation...attached again, to the deck. The piers are also connected to the 1 1/2'x1 1/2' footings with the pour. All the vertical posts on the deck, do infact penetrate the deck right through to the posts below and are all bolted, again with 4 dble dipped 1/2" thru bolts each to the joists.

I won't be getting a permit here so we won't need to discuss that again.

I'll get help where I can get it and this does including speaking with an architect shortly who does a lot of work for my employer. I am the building operator/project manager for the last 10 years for this facility. This roof will not kill anyone once I'm done with it so please don't make any assumptions. I won't be doing this in a hurry, trust me.

Ron6519 04-04-2009 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justahome (Post 254969)
You could just ask, Ron...the 9 posts are all connected to the piers or foundation in some fashion using the required galvanised, dble dipped coatings and connectors recommended by the manufacturer, not to go into details here. Those connectors were just sitting there in a pile or next to the posts. The posts weren't connected in the photo at that time. All bottom plates on the structure below are also hitied down to the foundation...attached again, to the deck. The piers are also connected to the 1 1/2'x1 1/2' footings with the pour. All the vertical posts on the deck, do infact penetrate the deck right through to the posts below and are all bolted, again with 4 dble dipped 1/2" thru bolts each to the joists.

I won't be getting a permit here so we won't need to discuss that again.

I'll get help where I can get it and this does including speaking with an architect shortly who does a lot of work for my employer. I am the building operator/project manager for the last 10 years for this facility. This roof will not kill anyone once I'm done with it so please don't make any assumptions. I won't be doing this in a hurry, trust me.

I responded to the information you provided in the photos. You said you were putting a roof on "that" deck. That deck was not properly secured. My assumptions were based upon the information provided.
Glad to hear you secured the posts.
The question is still, did someone with framing experience look at the deck construction? Is it capable of supporting a roof structure? Were the footings poured to the correct depth?
Don't want anyone to get hurt. Decks fall off houses at a fairly good clip. Especially during the warm weather.
Ron

Gary in WA 04-04-2009 05:15 PM

When you ask for help, you will also get observations. Some advice is from people and some is from professionals.

Ask your architect: what is the freeze depth for my pier blocks in my area, 8";
could I have run 4x4's from roof to concrete (16');
can I use doug/fir for the deck joists; do you think these piers will hold the load;
with double rims all around, what is the post/deck connection (they don't extend down);
and do I have to face nail cedar horizontal siding as per manufacture, even with 4" exposure;
do you think any water will follow the lags in my house post and rot the sheathing under the stucco, when it dries and shrinks?

Make sure to call your home insurance company, to let them know your deck is on the edge of the property and built without city's approval. Be safe, GBAR


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