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Old 08-24-2011, 02:55 PM   #61
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Mac VS PC


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Originally Posted by Leah Frances View Post
DH bought me a MacBook Air when he broke my old IBM.

Love it. Love it. Love it.

In 18 months it's crashed maybe three times.
- It always works.
- It's always fast.
- I've never had to de-frag, anti-virus, or undo anything.

Love it. Will never go back. Am saving my pennies for a Mac desktop.
See? koolaid. My Dell laptop has not crashed. Ever. I mean ever. And I've had ito for 5 years. How can anyone Love love love a computer that crashes 3 times in a year and a half?!? That's lost data, lost time, lost money. Koolaid I tells ya!

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Old 08-25-2011, 09:22 AM   #62
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Macs are like vtech kids toys. they do what they're made for, not more, no less, you can't customize or do anything special to it. PCs are more customizable, you can put Windows, Linux, whatever you want, customize it by adding more hardware, etc.... all that at half the price. I'll take a PC any time!
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Old 08-25-2011, 01:18 PM   #63
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I can't get past the 5 years with no crashes. This mythical computer has xp or vista and has never crashed; has it ever been turned on? It must be that you are just such a smooth operator? I operate PC's every day that only run one very expensive system operations software. These have never even been connected to the internet. I find your statement laughable.

Let me think isn't powerpoint a microsoft product?

I have xp, Win 7 and two versions of OSX on my macbook pro and can boot directly into any of the four. Just a short jaunt out on google and you will find many people running different flavors of Linux on theirs. How much upgrading do you really do to any laptop? With external ports I can add about anything I would want. Basically the same hard drives, disk drives and memory are used in either. Many systems have had processor upgrades available, the tower models have always been able to accept standard expansion cards.

You do realize many people have even built their own macs with off the shelf PC parts? They are called hackintosh; go ahead click the link, I'll do the work.

You are right, they do cost more up front. As with most anything speed, weight and size come with a price. Sleek, light, thin with extended battery life costs money, they are not for everyone. People pay more for options all the time, are they fools because they prefer leather seats instead of vinyl? Vinyl does the same job holding the seat together, in fact your greasy cheeseburger will even wipe off of vinyl easier. Why would anyone want a Ford Mustang instead of a Ford Fusion, you arrive the same either way.

Now while you go update your virus definitions, scan for malware, download the latest problem prevention, or figure out why you need to reinstall your system software every 6 months I have work to do.
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Old 09-09-2011, 10:16 PM   #64
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I move to mac since 2 years ago and never get back to windows again. I still touch windows sometimes, but it only if i need to run a software that only has win version, otherwise I use only mac for all my daily task since then
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Old 10-21-2011, 06:31 PM   #65
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Up until this past July I have only used window based pcs. Well theres no going back now, love the MacPro 13" laptop. No cons to mention, its awesome. A whole new world is being discovered.
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Old 11-14-2011, 03:53 PM   #66
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I think there's really no 'versus' to be discussed since the Mac and so-called "PC" (they are both PCs, FYI,) are designed with different functions in mind.

For most home-based use-cases, I'd even go so far as to say that OSX is perfectly sufficient.

That said... if there's only one thing I have to say to the Mac camp, it is this:

IT professionals refer to Apple technology as a "walled garden." Meaning, it is beautiful and pretty and in perfect harmony and whatnot, but you are within the confines of one vendor's product.

Want to install new apps on your iPhone? Go to the App store. Do you need something that's not listed? Too bad!
Want to use your iPad on a big screen? Plug it in, and hope your monitor supports that particular resolution. Not working? Too bad!
Record something on your Sony Handicam, and you want to sync it in iTunes? Good luck buddy!
Buy a new thumb drive that uses encryption, only to find out it doesn't work on the Mac? Too bad!

For typical home use, most peoples' needs are satisfied: Printing, email, web browsing, etc. But once you get outside of 'la la land' and into business computing, most of Apple's products are functionally useless. That's where Windows screams ahead of OSX, and that's why Windows runs in bazillions of places where OSX can't.
Ever see those new digital signs in shopping malls that play back video? Windows.
Self-checkout machines? Windows.
Half of the video signs in Times Square? Yup, Windows.

If you're not cut out for a complex system like Windows, that's fine. It is harder to fly a 747 than a 2-seat Piper. It's harder to find the blade on a 20-piece multitool than a little swiss army knife.

But to come back to my original point: It does not make sense to compare these things. The intended function is different!

Last edited by RedHelix; 11-14-2011 at 03:58 PM.
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Old 11-15-2011, 05:55 AM   #67
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I'm interested to see what will happen now that Steve-O is gone. I think he was the great majority of Apple's driving force.
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Old 11-15-2011, 11:29 PM   #68
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IT professionals refer to Apple technology as a "walled garden." Meaning, it is beautiful and pretty and in perfect harmony and whatnot, but you are within the confines of one vendor's product.
That is true of their iOS products. It is not true of their PC products running OSX, such as their laptops and desktops.

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But once you get outside of 'la la land' and into business computing, most of Apple's products are functionally useless. That's where Windows screams ahead of OSX, and that's why Windows runs in bazillions of places where OSX can't.
Ever see those new digital signs in shopping malls that play back video? Windows.
Self-checkout machines? Windows.
Half of the video signs in Times Square? Yup, Windows.
That's just plain not true. OSX is based on Unix and in fact you can drop into the Unix shell from the GUI and then you working on a system developed for corporate use that puts Windows to shame on many levels. I've worked in the software development industry, developing systems for major corporations for over 20 years and there are plenty of highly technical, scientific, creative, and other industries that use Macs extensively. Yes some specialized software is PC only, but the reverse is true as well.

Much of what you cite in terms of non-PC devices running windows, such as point of service systems and displays are PC centric because it has been easier to develop hardware drivers for Windows and because the hardware is cheaper. But that is a legacy issue and you already see that changing quite quickly.

For the record, I split time between the PC I built from scratch and my Mac laptop. To say one is fundamentally "better" than the other is just plain silly. They are largely equivalent, each with their own strengths and weaknesses but not really that far a part in the grand scheme of things.
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Old 11-16-2011, 11:58 AM   #69
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That is true of their iOS products. It is not true of their PC products running OSX, such as their laptops and desktops.
So I can install OSX on my Lenovo laptop, then?

(That's a rhetorical question; the answer is no.)

Quote:
That's just plain not true. OSX is based on Unix and in fact you can drop into the Unix shell from the GUI and then you working on a system developed for corporate use that puts Windows to shame on many levels.
I don't mean to come off as patronizing, but seriously, what are you talking about? Having access to a bash prompt does not automatically make an operating system relevant for corporate use; otherwise Linux would have routed Windows an awfully long time ago.

Further, I take issue with claiming OSX sports any kind of advantage because it's "Unix-based", whatever that means. Sure, OSX is a stripped down, barebones spinoff of FreeBSD - one of my favorite operating systems - but the only major similarities are the "Mach half" of it's hybrid kernel and some familiar bash commands.

So here's a question: Even if a Unix-like shell made an OS relevant in business, wouldn't I have to be high as a kite to choose OSX? Why would I lock my hardware and software into Apple when I can use Ubuntu, Fedora, etc for a whopping $0, or buy cheap Red Hat Enterprise licenses with support contracts?

Quote:
I've worked in the software development industry, developing systems for major corporations for over 20 years and there are plenty of highly technical, scientific, creative, and other industries that use Macs extensively. Yes some specialized software is PC only, but the reverse is true as well.
Of course there's loads of Mac-only software out there, I wouldn't try to argue otherwise. What I will point out, though, is 99.999% of the time, using Apple hardware is not a wise/economical decision for large corporations - particularly when you have the option to go with Mac or PC for the software required in the use-case. (CS 5.5, for example.)

Application virtualization (my area of expertise) is changing this, but only because it makes it easier to run Windows and Windows apps on a Mac.

For server hardware, though, forget about it. Apple's been getting laughed out of datacenters for years, and the story hasn't changed. Nor will it.

Quote:
Much of what you cite in terms of non-PC devices running windows, such as point of service systems and displays are PC centric because it has been easier to develop hardware drivers for Windows and because the hardware is cheaper. But that is a legacy issue and you already see that changing quite quickly.
None of this is even remotely accurate.

Displays/Service machines/etc usually take two paths: Windows Embedded Edition, or some basic distro/spinoff of Linux.

So without going into too much detail, the explanation is a lot simpler than you're making it out to be: Apple has never created an operating system purpose-built for single-use applications, like an ATM or a self-checkout. Microsoft has, and *nix just lends itself to it.
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Old 11-16-2011, 05:49 PM   #70
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I'm interested to see what will happen now that Steve-O is gone. I think he was the great majority of Apple's driving force.
Wasn't Wozniak the programmer and creator of the Apple and Jobs the marketer? Why does Jobs get all the credit?
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Old 11-17-2011, 05:54 AM   #71
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Wasn't Wozniak the programmer and creator of the Apple and Jobs the marketer? Why does Jobs get all the credit?
Because the marketing is what sells it. I'm not saying they can't develop a decent product, they've just lost the "face" of Apple.
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Old 11-23-2011, 08:19 AM   #72
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The ardent followers of each come out and state they have the best. I personally use Windows, but I tell people get what you want and can afford because in the end, there really isn't much difference between them.

1) User interface: Apple followers will swear up and down their interface is easier to use and the fact of the matter is, it is all opinion. If you like the Mac user interface go for it, if not there is Windows, Linux, Unix or DOS for that matter. Choose what is right for you

2) Hardware: Apple and PC use the exact same components. Same intel chips, southbridge, northbridge, hard drives and memory. They can also use the same display because there are only a few manufacters for displays, hard drives and processors. The only difference is in how they are made. Apple does a great job with constructing a solid laptop with the aluminum base in the MacBook pros. PCs can use the aluminum or magenesium alloy and can have similar properties, but you can find cheap plastic cases too. It depends on what you need and the price you are willing to pay.

3) Macs get Malware too and by Apple's own confession recommends Antivirus software. Remember MacDefender? In the IT world there is such a thing as zero day viruses, which means antivirus software does not have the signatures to recognize an attack. For those who have a Mac and claim the feel safe and secure, how will you know if your computer is compromised? Most malware writers now adays are not stupid enough to crash the computer. They are there for your personal information. I love how apple.com states Macs don't get PC viruses, well of course, they don't get PC viruses, PC viruses are written for PCs. They do, however, get Mac Viruses.

4) PCs and Macs have similar programs and you can find alternatives where ever you go. Shoot Macs can run Windows if you want

5) No company has a monopoly on virtue. Everyone calls microsoft evil and apple the great saint. Fact of the matter is Apple loves to litigate and even sue school districts because they have an Apple logo. How about the first "iphone?" It was actually a product made by Cisco. Apple litigated and negotiated til they had rights to it. The first "ipod" was actually a counter that sat on the back of a pinball machine. Apple sued that company to have the name changed.

So, in essence. Choose the one that works for you. This is a debate just like Chevy vs Ford. Each have their strengths and weaknesses and you can't compare one product's strengths to the other product's weaknesses. It shows a clear bias and creates lots and lots of confusion.

<steps off soap box and takes a deep breath and a glass of water/>

Last edited by cscpianoman; 11-23-2011 at 08:25 AM.
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Old 11-24-2011, 06:21 PM   #73
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Through the years, I have probably purchased as many Apple machines as PCs, especially back in the days when there was a difference in user interfaces and Macs probably had a distinct advantage for designers. I always felt Apple was holding me hostage though. I had to buy their parts or deal with their arrogant service people when I could buy components for PCs and put them in myself. And then of course the software was significantly more expensive too.

Some years ago I forced a major transition from Apple based video editing equipment in use by my staff. There was moaning and groaning at first but the adjustment period was very short and I was able to deliver them a phenomenal editing capability with Windows components for a fraction of what something like the AVID and Apple world would have cost.

I would never own an Apple product because the company epitomizes the concept of intellectual property theft. For example, Apple had nothing to do with invention of the mouse. It came out of Xerox PARC labs. Jobs and all taught an entire generation or two it is just fine to steal music. If you own the player, anything you can make work on it is free game.

And Apple products were unjustifiably expensive to start. And they do break to the point one place I ran had to have an extra because only two of three worked at any given time. And security? The Apple OS has been the first to be hacked in the international competition for almost five years now. So much for the arrogance. You actually do not see so many ads boasting about security advantages any more.

I will give credit to the company with coming up with some beautiful industrial design and forcing some issues on that front. And no doubt whether with stolen mice or whatever the company forced issues of user friendliness that probably would not have happened without is influence. And I do understand its loyal following. I am happy to say I am not part of the throng. Had to laugh at a tongue and cheek ad for the new Apple iCooker. It showed a crockpot with an Apple logo and basically suggested Appleheads would buy anything with an Apple logo on it.
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Old 11-26-2011, 05:47 PM   #74
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Agree... Apple provides limited functionality (for example, devices w/o SD card slots... are you kidding me????) that have ridiculous limits and controls on everything. They make sense for someone that needs a dead simple device IF they are willing to buy into (figuratively and literally) what Apple wants them to have... and pay high $$ for the priveledge. Otherwise it is a style thing for some as in it is what all the cool kids get. If you aspire to that then Apple is for you.
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Old 11-26-2011, 09:34 PM   #75
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Agree... Apple provides limited functionality (for example, devices w/o SD card slots... are you kidding me????) that have ridiculous limits and controls on everything. They make sense for someone that needs a dead simple device IF they are willing to buy into (figuratively and literally) what Apple wants them to have... and pay high $$ for the priveledge. Otherwise it is a style thing for some as in it is what all the cool kids get. If you aspire to that then Apple is for you.

Except Google is abandoning SD cards on the new Nexus phones. And Motorola is abandoning removable batteries on the Droid Razr. So the functionality is going on other stuff too. Google has also removed apps from the store under pressure from carriers. (Tethering apps.)

And I have a Droid X. Gave up my iPhone 3g for it. It's a POS and so is Android. It was good in the beginning. Decent phone and OK os. Nowhere near as polished as iOS. But it had potential; it was serviceable and had features my iPhone wouldn't have. Now a year and a half later:

1. Vibrate motor died.
2. Gingerbread upgrade is horrible. Phone will reboot playing MP3's at random times. Phone will reboot when it feels like. Phone is sluggish.
3. Google services seem disconnected and not fully baked.
4. Phone has a horrible E-mail client. I use MailDroid as the stock app doesn't work with IMAP worth a cr@p.
5. WiFi has always been a joke and unreliable (over 2 Droid X's)
6. 3G hotspot works when it feels like it (2 DX's)
7. Phone is overall sluggish.
8. Battery life went from OK to abysmal.

Most of these things are probably a result of Gingerbread. But I am doubtful I'll see Ice Cream Sandwich on this phone and there is no way to go back to the previous OS.

Contrast that to my iPhone 3g that I sold to a coworker last year. He's still using it and it works fine. He's got no complaints.

I can't wait until the iPhone 5 so I can get rid of the POS that is the Droid X and Android.

Neither is better than the other; just different ways of doing things.

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