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Old 05-22-2013, 09:33 PM   #1
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Replalcement window Florida


OK, I am in the initial phases of this project and gettting over whelmed with info.

This is going into a concrete block stucco house! Wind zones, design pressures, aluminum, vinyl, impact, single hung, double hung etc.

I would like to do impact windows and do this with a permit so I can get the insurance credit. I talked with a local carpenter and he claims that vinyl not aluminum is the way to go, cause aluminum corrodes?

I would like to use impact windows, so lacking a starting point I called HOme Depot and a sales guy showed up. $13,444 for for 7 windows and a french door, not likely to happen! High quality insulated, impact windows PGT, but still I am not budgeting that much for windows.

I went to a local window supplier today and was told they do not sell to the public!

Florida impact windows for dummy's book? Is the xtra cost of impacts justified by the insurance savings?

Any input, thoughts, opinions or wisecracks greatly appreciated. JIm

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Old 05-23-2013, 06:10 AM   #2
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Replalcement window Florida


The impact rating does not drive up the cost that much. You should be able to find something good in the range of $450-$900 installed ( give or take a little). PGT and Gorell are very good options that you have down there. Contact the manufacturers to locate dealers/installers.

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Old 05-23-2013, 08:45 PM   #3
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Replalcement window Florida


Thanks for the response. I stopped at 84 lumber, they are going to send me a quote on just windows. I got the impression that the clerk was not real knowledgeable.

A friend sent me to a friend who called his cousin and got a quote for me for Winguard aluminum impact windows. The total was $4500. Seems reasonable an example was a Windguard aluminum impact 6X6'8" french door for $1,700. Don't have a model #. This is not installed.

None of my windows appear to be standard size, so everything will be made.

There is a manufacturer about a 100 miles from here, so I am going to take the wife for a road trip next week and see if they have an outlet or opp's store.

This is slowly coming together, just too many options and codes. JIm
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Old 05-26-2013, 08:28 AM   #4
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Replalcement window Florida


There is not much info for the DIY'er on impact windows in FL. One little bit of info I picked up is not all impact windows are created equal. There is large and small missile ratings. How this affects code and insurance or price, I do not know yet. But will post anything I find. JIm
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Old 05-27-2013, 08:26 AM   #5
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Replalcement window Florida


I would specify the windows to be Dade County rated. That is the highest of all the impact ratings and the benchmark that most manufacturers test their windows too.

Not being a standard size should not drive the cost up that much, if any. Florida construction doesn't lend itself to real standard sizes.
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Old 05-27-2013, 12:38 PM   #6
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Replalcement window Florida


Thanks for the response. But does MIami dade have 2 ratings, small and large impact? May be the difference in price on what the Big Box stores carry in stock and what is ordered.

There appears to be two different laminates, one is PVB and one is SGP. I am not clear on which is used where and why yet?

Home Deopot carries an impact rated patio french door for $1000 and the cheapest I can order is $1700. I have not been able to talk to a salesman yet to find out why such a big difference? Both are Winguard widows, but HD's is steel covered wood, the $1700 is aluminum, but $700 difference?

Glad I am not in a hurry to do this!

JIm
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Old 05-27-2013, 05:04 PM   #7
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Replalcement window Florida


Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrbus View Post
Thanks for the response. But does MIami dade have 2 ratings, small and large impact? May be the difference in price on what the Big Box stores carry in stock and what is ordered.

There appears to be two different laminates, one is PVB and one is SGP. I am not clear on which is used where and why yet?

Home Deopot carries an impact rated patio french door for $1000 and the cheapest I can order is $1700. I have not been able to talk to a salesman yet to find out why such a big difference? Both are Winguard widows, but HD's is steel covered wood, the $1700 is aluminum, but $700 difference?

Glad I am not in a hurry to do this!

JIm
Copied from my buddy Oberon:

Laminated glass is simply two (or more) lites of glass bonded to a plastic interlayer for strength. Laminated glass is no stronger against breakage than is the glass it is made of. Let me say that again - laminated glass breaks as easily as the glass it is made of. I mention that because many folks have the mistaken impression that laminated glass / impact windows won’t easily break. They will break, but the glass adheres to the plastic interlayer and keeps the envelope of the home closed.
There are four major food groups in the impact glass world (a few other ones as well) relating to the interlayers used to manufacture the laminates.
First we have PVB or Polyvinyl Butyral. This is the stuff that is in the windshield of your car. It is relatively soft and very flexible, yet it is also tough and doesn’t tear easily. This is probably the most widely used product in the impact glass market since it does great when impacted. It stops whatever hits it and stretches to absorb the impact (such as a persons head in a car accident). PVB is a good product and is the choice for many manufacturers.
The second interlayer type is a hybrid of PVB with a layer of PET film between the PVB layers. This is a very tough product and it performs very nicely.
The third type of interlayer is called SGP or Sentry Glass Plus. This is quite a bit different from PVB in that it is very stiff and very tough. It is becoming something of the product of choice in some of the toughest applications (including some bullet and bomb resistance applications).
It is also can be more than a bit more expensive than PVB and may be overkill for some residential applications – but I think it is ultimately the best product on the market at this date.
SGP has become the product of choice for a number of the wood window manufacturers. Although vinyl folks don’t seem to be using it quite as much yet, SGP does seem to be growing in the vinyl market as well. I suspect that one reason SGP is a little behind in vinyl windows is because SGP’s rigidity tends to transfer the impact force to the frame of the window rather than absorbing the impact in the glass as does PVB. While the best vinyl windows can handle the force of an impact when using SGP as the laminate interlayer, not all vinyl windows are strong enough to take that force.
As a rule, aluminum windows tend to be pretty strong and can generally use any of the mentioned interlayer laminates.
The fourth product line is the resin laminates – where a liquid resin is poured between two lites of glass and allowed to cure. I see liquid resin laminate as the "mom and pop shop" of laminated glass – although some larger manufacturers do use it. For the manufacturer it is cheap, it is easy, and it is an acceptable "mom and pop shop" product.
Impact rated windows - or to answer your question - Dade County Approved windows are tested to the same air, water, and structural testing that I mentioned earlier, but in addition they are required to twice successfully stop an 8', 9lb 2x4 that is fired at the window at 50fps.
If the impact window is able to stop the 2x4 - without penetration of the glazing - then the unit is subjected to 9000 high and low pressure cycles at up to 100% of the DP rating.
If the window manages to stop the two 2x4 impacts, and manages to successfully complete the 9000 pressure cycles, it still has to operate in order to successfully pass the entire testing sequence and get the Miami Dade Approval.
There are several advantages to using impact glass rather than shutters – not having to travel for hours to protect your home if you happen to be away for some reason is certainly a huge one – but beyond that:
First, and best (and restating), they are passive protection…you don't have to do a thing to protect your house if a storm is coming. If you are out-of-town, the house is protected.

Second, (and re-restating) they are passive protection...not just from storms, but also from unfriendly people who might want to enter your home when you are not there. Imagine trying to break thru a window or door that has been designed and built to withstand winds of over 150mph and at the same time to withstand impacts from a 2x4 projectile that turns plywood into kindling. Burglars look elsewhere.

Laminated glass, used in impact windows, blocks 99% of UV light from entering your home and also acts as a significant sound barrier as well. Homes that are near airports that are remodeled for soundproofing are retrofitted with laminated glass for that reason. But, those homes generally use a much thinner version than is used for impact resistance.
Unfortunately, looting is sometimes a problem after a major storm, and again that passive protection that impact windows gives you will help keep your belongings in your home long after the storm. The folks who do the deed are going to look at the homes that don't have that sort of protection.
Also, those folks who use shutters or plywood to protect their homes are going to be living in a windowless cave as long as they are in the house with the coverings in place. Folks with impact windows don't have to do that.
From a cost versus value comparison, IF you are planning to replace your windows anyway and you are planning to go with higher-end windows, then replacing your existing windows with impact units is cost-competitive with getting impact shutters.
If you are not planning to replace your windows - except to install impact units - then the cost of window replacement can be significantly more than the cost of installing shutters.

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