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Old 10-11-2011, 01:27 PM   #1
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


I recently picked up - for dirt cheap - a very nice Anderson sliding patio door. The problem - its a 6" door and I have 4" walls. I live in the cold northeast so replacing my old aluminum framed door that has a broken thermopane seal is high on the project list before winter.

I was originally thinking that I would just allow the extra depth to overlap on the inside of the wall and trim it out nicely with some custom molding. I figure since the sides will be covered by curtains and the top by a custom made insulated cornice, nobody would really notice.

But a friend of mine said that I should install the door with it protruding to the exterior of the house and trim it out there. Seems counter intuitive as I would think I would be asking for leaks to get behind the trim.

Has anybody done this sort of thing and how did it work out for you?

Thanks
Merrill

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Old 10-11-2011, 03:25 PM   #2
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


Hi there M,
Is that 6" measurement overall width? I ask because Andersens and
many other units are designed to have a nailing flange that is attached
about 1" back from outside face of unit. This attaches to your wall under
the stucco or siding. Regarding your 4" wall: That's pretty thin. Does
that include 2x4 stud and drywall inside? Then will it get stucco or siding
outside?

It would help to know those dimensions for us to give you better advice.

In general I would typically install unit with any excess frame width
extending into the house. Generally better from a weatherproofing and
from a trim standpoint. Just rip some filler strips to take up the space
behind the casing and you will be good to go.

There are other concerns about opening preparation, caulking, etc.
but this will at least help us advise you better. I am sure that others
will have great input for you.

Best of luck with the project!
RC/DG

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Old 10-11-2011, 05:48 PM   #3
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


Please pardon my shorthand in referring to 4" VS. 6". By 4" wall I mean that it is studded with 2X4s as apposed to 2X6s. The door was removed from a remodel of a building that had 2X6 walls.
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Old 10-11-2011, 06:14 PM   #4
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


Hi M,
Thanks for the clarification...I probably should have guessed at that one!

If you have the nailing flanges still attached I would screw them directly
to the 2x4 stud with proper flashing installed first (moiststop or better yet
the black peal and stick products. Then run a bead of poly caulk around
opening and screw the unit to the studs after you shim it into place.
Level your sill area first and caulk the bejeebers out of that area hitting
the contact parts on the bottom of unit.

Check your work periodically with the longest level that will fit....6'6 for
example or a shorter one with a straight edge will work. After you get
3 or 4 screws installed check the operation and alignment of the doors.
Much easier to make adjustments while caulk is still wet.

Then do all of the fillers inside your house to work out the extra
jamb width.

RC/DG
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Old 10-11-2011, 06:30 PM   #5
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


I was thinking I would keep an eye on the plumb and level with my laser level. I did see a youtube video talking about the rubber backed adhesive tape. I like that approach - I will get some of that and a bunch of caulking.

I also thought I would fill the crevices inside with "Great Stuff" expanding foam. I saw a caution on that, however, to be sure to use the minimally expanding type so as not to distort the door frame.

I planned to run flashing from the door sill down 6 inches or so to give a little added protection. Is flashing typically used around the sides or top - seems unnecessary?

I also saw where some people suggest using an expanding material between the outside trim and the door frame to prevent binding caused by the wood swelling. Is this typical or is somebody just being a little over cautious?

Thanks for all the great advice - I just stumbled onto this site today - but it is certainly going into my bookmarks list ...

Merrill
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Old 10-11-2011, 06:50 PM   #6
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


Hi Merrill,
Laser level: Depends on the type that you have. You will want to level
the sill if necessary. I use heart redwood 1 1/2" material ripped to the
correct thickness every 16" or so. Hold them in place with caulking and
then make sure that your caulking is high enough to reach bottom of sill
all the way across the opening. Two or three beads of caulk are best.
Do not use silcone caulk..Use Polyurethane caulking...It bonds much better.
Even after your sill is leveled you will want to plumb up the sides so hopefully
your laser has a vertical function.

Great Stuff: Good product. Make sure you use the one that says it is for
windows and doors. even with that, be sure that your jambs are shimmed
and nailed solidly so that it does not bow out under pressure.

Flashing: When you say flashing are you referring to the metal product
or one of the 6" wide rolled products? Metal would only need to be
installed across bottom...Caulk under it and over it. Black peel and stick
should go on sides and top and bottom if you don't use metal.

Expanding material: Not sure what you mean by this but the spray foam
can be good to use under the exterior trim for that extra sealing. Don't
use to much because it's tough to clean up. I use acetone to wipe up
excess.

RC/DG
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Last edited by TheDoorGuy; 10-11-2011 at 06:51 PM. Reason: clarity
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Old 10-12-2011, 05:14 AM   #7
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDoorGuy View Post
If you have the nailing flanges still attached I would screw them directly
to the 2x4 stud
You mean sheathing, don't you?
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Old 10-12-2011, 06:09 AM   #8
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


I have to say, it is kind of difficult to say the best way to do it without seeing the details of your home. An extra 2" of frame protruding into the interior will be awfully hard to cover up and will look ridiculous. It is possible that you could push it toward the exterior or split the difference. At least on the outside things can be masked a little bit better with some trim coil, etc.
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Old 10-12-2011, 06:48 AM   #9
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If it was my house I’d push it to the outside. Leaks aren’t a issue if flashed properly.

No matter which way you go it will look odd. I’d just assume not to be reminded of it every time I’m sitting on the couch.
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Old 10-12-2011, 07:05 AM   #10
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


Quote:
Originally Posted by kwikfishron View Post
You mean sheathing, don't you?
Sure, whatever the outside face of framed surface is...Stud or shear panel.
just make sure that it has the proper water proofing flashing installed.

Thanks for helping clarify...I am not so big on framing stuff!

RC/DG
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Old 10-12-2011, 08:25 AM   #11
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


I don't know why this didn't occur to me before, but most sgd's have a standard frame depth, then jamb extensions are factory applied to when needed. It is very possible that there is a jamb extension tacked onto the interior of the door that you could just knock off. I don't install many Andersens, so I'm not sure, but I'd check that out first.
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Old 11-12-2011, 12:45 PM   #12
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


hey guys,i just installed a patio door made for 4' wall in my house with 6' walls,i pulled the door in so i didn't have to remove any siding,a few filler stroips cut from a sheet of mdf and looks like it was made to fit,no problem sealing for drafts,water leakage,i think if i pushed it out it would have looked really out of place facing my deck,can't even notice it was made to fit from looking at it from inside
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Old 11-12-2011, 12:56 PM   #13
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


hey,i just caulked between the brick nould and the j moulding on my siding,made filler strips from a sheet of mdf,door looks like it was made for there,i think if i had pushed the door out it would have looked stupid,once the filler strops were painted and moulding went up,door looked great looking at it from inside,i couldn't imagine what it would have looked like by pushing it out,oh,had to put down a few strips of ceramic tile to nake up the difference too,but not much of a problem
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Old 11-12-2011, 01:11 PM   #14
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6" Sliding Patio Door in a 4" Wall


Quote:
Originally Posted by drifterss454 View Post
hey guys,i just installed a patio door made for 4' wall in my house with 6' walls,i pulled the door in so i didn't have to remove any siding,a few filler stroips cut from a sheet of mdf and looks like it was made to fit,no problem sealing for drafts,water leakage,i think if i pushed it out it would have looked really out of place facing my deck,can't even notice it was made to fit from looking at it from inside
The OP had the opposite problem.... Installing a thinner frame into a wider wall is a pretty easy solution (as you've found out) and is very commonplace.

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