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Old 02-08-2012, 02:36 PM   #1
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split foyer insulation


looking for ideas on cold bed rooms in a split foyer house. all three bedrooms are above the garage. house was built in 1968. have a older 90% gas furnace thats been cleaned and inspected

walls roughly have old craft face r-9 or so insulation. attic has loose insulation in every bay plus r-19 unfaced rolld on top of every bay so maybe r-25 total. garage ceiling/bedroom floors im unsure at this point.


I have one bedroom that is about 10 degrees colder than the rest of the house on cold days but during the summer with the air on it was very similar to every other room. all bed rooms have newer windows from about 2006. and recessed lights and ceiling fans added this past summer when i bought the house.


Should i look into the floor not being insulated or focus on other areas. the garage walls are not insulated or finished.

just looking for input at this point wont do any work till summer/fall probably

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Old 02-08-2012, 02:54 PM   #2
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split foyer insulation


http://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm?...sulation_table

It going to be a lot easyer to get better answers if you go back and look at the top of the page and look on the right where your name is, hit that and add your location.
How did you come up with the R9 figure for the walls? Should be a min. of R-13 in a 2 X 4 wall, R-19 in a 2 X 6 wall.
Very common to have rooms over garages to be colder. Most often the builder cheaped out on the insulation and did not seal the holes where the wiring ran through the plates.
Did they put in IC, Air Tite can llights? If there not then cold air can leak in.
One cheap thing you can do is add the foam pads behind the outlets and switches.
When you say there newer windows, are the replacement windows?

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Old 02-08-2012, 03:22 PM   #3
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added my location sorry about that.

I did install IC rated can so they are insulated. they also have CFL bulbs in them so they dont really get hot.

The R-9 in the walls was a guess. we had one wall opened up while re doing the kitchen and it was done ok but i figured since its insulation from the late 60's it doesnt follow the current ratings so i subtracted a few for that.

as for the windows they were replaced im not sure if they are "replacement"
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Old 02-08-2012, 05:23 PM   #4
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Picture of the home would be very helpful.

IC does not mean air tight.

Most rooms that are over garages have copious amounts of connectivity between the unconditioned (outside) and conditioned space.

Garages very often times have the insulation in the floor drop and the resultant loss of R-Value in the floor makes the floor a massive cold spot.

Pictures are helpful
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Old 02-08-2012, 09:33 PM   #5
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ok im not sure what pictures you want right not but i took two quick ones in the garage. I also dug out the big for the recessed lights they are indeed Airtight IC rated housings with the matching trim.

in the picture below the only part of the ceiling i have been into is in the back right corner. i built a access panel as that ceiling drop down gives you access to the tub drain for the bath room above. While i was in there i insulated the garage side/bottom with R-13 craft face with the faced side down. (garage is a disaster i know)




this picture is looking across the garage the garage door would be on the left. the "coldest" room would be right above the car in the picture

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Old 02-09-2012, 07:58 PM   #6
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We had a similar problem in our home. As a rule especially for homes of that age there's very little insulation in the ceiling of the garage. We pulled down the sheetrock and had 6" of closed cell insulation applied and then put up new sheetrock. The rooms above the garage are now warm in the winter and cool in the summer there is no noticeable difference between them and the rest of the house.
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Old 02-09-2012, 09:35 PM   #7
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I figured that it would come down to pulling the sheet rock and reinsulating due to poor insulation.

If i was to pull the sheet ro k and insulate what would be the best combo for insulation?

Is a spray foam going to be worth the added costs compared to your typical fiberglass.
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Old 02-09-2012, 09:46 PM   #8
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Fig. 7: http://www.buildingscience.com/docum...n-crawlspaces/
Be sure to cover it with 5/8" Type X drywall or per local fire-code, and fire-tape the joints.

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Old 02-10-2012, 01:28 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmartin View Post
I figured that it would come down to pulling the sheet rock and reinsulating due to poor insulation.

If i was to pull the sheet ro k and insulate what would be the best combo for insulation?

Is a spray foam going to be worth the added costs compared to your typical fiberglass.
In an overhead situation like that you are somewhat limited in what you can use. Using batts of fiberglass is one option but these basically provide very poor insulating qualities. You can use rigid foam sheets but it's an awful lot of work especially when working overhead like this. Spray foam has the distinct advantage of not only providing high R values for a given thickness but it also provides a very good barrier for air infiltration. It's obviously not the cheapest option but it's certainly the best in the long term.
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Old 02-13-2012, 10:01 AM   #10
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Im going to venture to say Spray foam isnt going to happen due to price. the sq footage of the floor is about 550.

That building science site is nice. Ill have to spend a little more time reading the article but it looks like they recomened fiberglass batts between the joists and then foam sitting on the joists. so this would effectivly lower my ceiling height 1"

the foam over the wood is to stop the heat from coming down the joists out the ceiling of the garage or vice versa i think.

Ment to get around to opening up the ceiling in a few places this weekend to check out current insulation but had other projects keeping me busy.
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Old 02-13-2012, 10:03 AM   #11
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Also it slippled my mind but about 2 feet of the beed rooms on the front of the house hang over the garage so this would give direct contact to outside temps if there is a lack of insulation going on in that area
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Old 02-13-2012, 10:43 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmartin View Post
Also it slippled my mind but about 2 feet of the beed rooms on the front of the house hang over the garage so this would give direct contact to outside temps if there is a lack of insulation going on in that area
Obviously insulation in that area would be extremely critical.
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Old 02-13-2012, 11:12 AM   #13
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At the cantilever area; isolate the area from the garage with solid blocking for a fire-stop. Fiberglass, or better- Roxul in the cavity with foil-faced foamboard (taped) on the joist bottoms to stop the radiant/thermal bridging as per article, read it.....covered with soffit plywood- caulked.

BTW- in the garage ceiling, facing on f.g. goes to the warmed side, turn it over-facing up.
The "biggest loser" in fiberglass insulation....

Gary
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Old 02-13-2012, 11:50 AM   #14
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finished reading the article and it does seem like the best solution would result in my ending up with a 1" shorter ceiling height. as shown in figure 7 of the article.

So guess that will be my best plan of attack and ill just have to save up some money/apply for energy rebates for the insulation. Might as well do it right and keep it in my budget if i plan on staying in the house for 10 years

The cantilever section might be the first area taking care of come this spring. adding the fire block etc
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Old 02-14-2012, 10:38 PM   #15
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Good to go.... 5/8" Type X drywall on ceiling.

Gary

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