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Old 05-28-2013, 11:18 AM   #16
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


My friends father died from asbestos related complications, don't risk it if you don't think it is safe. Best to err on the side of caution.

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Old 05-28-2013, 01:15 PM   #17
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


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Originally Posted by JamesT79 View Post
My friends father died from asbestos related complications, don't risk it even if you don't think it is safe. Best to err on the side of caution.
Again, do you realize that it takes years to be around the material, before you show complications. Coal miners still have "Black Lung" disease, even though they take precautions, but it takes years for it to set in.

Stuff like this is not going to happen from a hour or even 8 hours of exposure to material, during demo process. You have to be breathing it in for decades, or already have a pre-existing condition that enhances the capability to end up with lung disorders earlier.

It is like how people blame Radon on Lung Cancer, only because it is a easy scapegoat to set blame on something, that people even after these years, still do not fully understand everything about it.

It took decades of scientists and geneticists, to figure out exactly what was going on with those breathing in stuff like fine dust in mining operations, both from stuff like Coal, Asbestos, Gypsum, etc..
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Old 05-28-2013, 01:22 PM   #18
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


I've contacted the CDC regarding Asbestos exposure and they basically said the same thing as the previous post. The majority of reported illnesses were from people who worked in industries where they were exposed on a consistent basis. That said, I don't want it in my house and will take all precautions when dealing with any material that might contain it.
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Old 05-28-2013, 03:13 PM   #19
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


Just a FYI on asbestos. it is only dangerous if its fibers are airborn. out side of that it is safe. these are things that still have it in it even trace amounts. Here is a list of what is still alowwed to use it in America.
  • brake pads
  • automobile clutches
  • roofing materials
  • vinyl tile
  • and, imported cement pipe and corrugated sheeting
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Old 05-28-2013, 06:18 PM   #20
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


why even take the chance. ya you wont see the effects for 20 years but i want to live longer then that. i take all the precautions cause im not lucky and something like that will come back to bite me in the A.
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Old 05-28-2013, 06:39 PM   #21
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


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why even take the chance. ya you wont see the effects for 20 years but i want to live longer then that. i take all the precautions cause im not lucky and something like that will come back to bite me in the A.
You have breathed in so much bad stuff over the years that you live, a couple of hours with a mask on, so you do not soak your nostrils with dust, is not going to hurt you taking down that gyprock.

Too many people get the Chicken Little effect, when dealing with old houses. You actually have more danger taking a walk, or driving in your car and dying from the effect of someone hitting you, then you do, doing some demo in your home.

Because of being in the Navy, I have to get a semi-yearly breathing test, due to working around Lead paint, breathing in toxic fumes from the chemicals we used on board ship, also working around aircraft when they sat idle, running the APU's. Every test I have had to take, comes up clean, and every chest x-ray dating over 26 years, show no signs of any lung disorders.

Even after I demoed our bath & shared wall between the Kitchen & dining, my doctor was concerned of possible breathing in more dust than a person normally would, and still no signs after ten years from the after affects.

You are putting more fear into this, then you really should be.
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Old 05-28-2013, 07:42 PM   #22
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


you can take risks greg and i wont and i will not recommend taking a risk.
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Old 05-28-2013, 08:26 PM   #23
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


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and to back up gregzol it takes 20 plus years to get cancer from asbestos.
Not always, and it doesn't always take a lot of exposure either, in theory breathing in just one particle can do it. In actuality we just don't know for sure about any of this, it's all speculation and to say its 20 years is like saying no child under age 20 should ever have cancer either, fact is even toddlers have been known to develop cancer, brain tumors etc and die.
The best exposure to asbestos is ZERO exposure, every exposure no matter how small increases risk, what that risk is will vary by individual.

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Every test I have had to take, comes up clean, and every chest x-ray dating over 26 years, show no signs of any lung disorders.
That's great, but there are many people out there who do the same things and wind up dead or incapacitated, everyone has a different tolerance level to things, yours may be especially or abnormally high, while someone else might be abnormally low.

This is similar to people with allergies, I work with someone who can't tolerate any kind of fumes or odors, there are people who get severe problems from a little bit of pollin, while others can go walking thru a field full of it and have no problem at all, one guy I work with has severe allergies to many things- mold, pollin, fumes etcs, he's always going to the allergist for shots and pills, the slightest bit of mold really sends him off, while none of that bothers me in the least.
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Old 05-28-2013, 08:59 PM   #24
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


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Not always, and it doesn't always take a lot of exposure either, in theory breathing in just one particle can do it. In actuality we just don't know for sure about any of this, it's all speculation and to say its 20 years is like saying no child under age 20 should ever have cancer either, fact is even toddlers have been known to develop cancer, brain tumors etc and die.
The best exposure to asbestos is ZERO exposure, every exposure no matter how small increases risk, what that risk is will vary by individual.
A lot of that has found to be genetics that are why toddlers have developed cancer, brain tumors, Leukemia.
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Old 05-28-2013, 09:02 PM   #25
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


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you can take risks greg and i wont and i will not recommend taking a risk.
Then I would suggest not going out for a walk or drive also. Again, the product we are talking about is no more of a risk, than the current building materials of today. If you ever have driven through a construction zone, area that has had large fires, or live in an area that has annual timber or grass fires, or drive in rush hour traffic, you breathe more toxins and pollutants during that time, than you will for this small little project.

Just wear long sleeves, a good face mask, put up plastic to keep the dust from spreading, tape off any vents in the space, that go to the furnace, use a fan to pull air out into the outside of the structure, and you will be fine.

As for discarding the materials, place the bag you place the debris in, into another bag, to double bag it, and then tie off, place in dumpster to be taken to construction debris dump and you will have no problems.
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Old 05-29-2013, 12:04 AM   #26
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


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Again, do you realize that it takes years to be around the material, before you show complications. Coal miners still have "Black Lung" disease, even though they take precautions, but it takes years for it to set in.

..

Coal is different from asbestos, the coal dust basically clogs up the lungs, you essentially lose the air exchange capacity, i.e the surface areas of the lung tissues that allow for exchange of oxygen with carbon dioxide is reduced by scarring and particles embedded, so basically it's a form of silicosis where you gradually lose the ability to exchange the two gasses and you suffocate to death.

Gypsum is a nuissance dust, but unlike coal, sand, asbestos, gypsum breaks down in water. I can tell you that if you leave any gypsum plasters in water like a bucket of water, it begins breaking down and decays. In the moist lungs this process would happen on a smaller scale, the lungs can repair and clean.

With asbestos, think of the microscopic particles as being tiny RAZOR BLADES with sharp points, as these embed into the tissues of the lungs they cause irritation and jabbing, it is this irritation, cutting and jabbing which causes inflamation, irritation, and scarring as the lungs try encapsulating the particles. But the cutting, jabbing and irritation along with the inflamation continues with every breath you take.
Over time the scarring becomes more extensive, like a large callous on your foot from chaffing. It is this constant irritation, inflamation and scarring which causes damage, which can start cancer, and which reduces lung capacity and at some tipping point the lungs lose so much capacity you are essentially suffocating even if you dont get cancer.

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Stuff like this is not going to happen from a hour or even 8 hours of exposure to material, during demo process. You have to be breathing it in for decades,
It doesn't matter how long you breathe asbestos in, whether it's one hour, 8 hours, 1 year or on the job, ONE particle is all it takes to start the irritation, inflamation and scarring where it embeds in the lung tissue, once it's in the lungs it's never coming out again, the lungs can't break it down or flush it out.
Every particle of asbestos you breathe in is not going to just go away, it's embedded there permanently.

It goes without saying that the more you breathe in the more damage and the more risk, obviously someone spraying asbestos on a ship hull 40 hours a week on the job is going to breathe in a lot more than the guy who walks past the ship on the dock and only breathed in a few lungfulls of dust, but the guy on the dock might be especially prone to cancer, while the guy spraying it especially resistant to cancer, there is no way to tell.

The key word here is RISK, there is no known safe amount of this stuff to breathe in and some people can be more prone to cancer than others, but there is no test to tell, thus you can only wisely assume you might be the one in a hundred who is more prone to cancer than your neighbor or the guy down the street, and take precautions to reduce RISK.

I certainly agree on the boogey-man scam of radon, most people don't LIVE in the basement any more than they sleep next to a nuclear reactor core at a nuclear power plant.
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Old 05-29-2013, 12:13 AM   #27
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A lot of that has found to be genetics that are why toddlers have developed cancer, brain tumors, Leukemia.
Oh for sure, agree 100% there Greg, trouble is we don't have any tests to know who is prone to something like lung cancer and who isn't.
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Old 05-29-2013, 12:26 AM   #28
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


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I've contacted the CDC regarding Asbestos exposure and they basically said...

Personally, and with all due respect to you Jim, I don't give a rat's fat a... what the CDC says, if you do some research on the matter of the CDC history, you will trust the CDC as much as you'd trust your local street gang with your house key and credit card info.

Doing a little research you learn the CDC is another govt shill and scam, it's morphed from the days of the govt branches collectively known as the "health department" etc DO a google search on the involvement with the Tuskeegee experiment, on the experimental hepatitus vaccine given gay men in NYC just months before the first cases of the HIV epidemic started in that very city. Do some research on the fluoridated water scam, and the more recent one of declaring the air around the WTC after 9/11 was "safe" so Wall street could be opened up fast, but proven later to be anything but safe.
All roads of the various health scams and things like illegal experiments (Tuskeegee and others) lead right back to the same govt departments which have morphed, merged and been renamed over the decades. Like I say, I trust what the CDC claims or tells me about as much as I would trust a Chicago street gang with my credit card and house key.

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That said, I don't want it in my house and will take all precautions when dealing with any material that might contain it
Excellent move Jim, if you can't get rid of it encapsulate it, this works well.
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Old 05-29-2013, 07:48 AM   #29
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


Are there test kits to determine if asbestos is present in material or does someone have to come and test it where it's at.

when was asbestos band in the u.s.a.

can the city say what areas might be more ikely to have asbestos

or just anything built before the eighty's suspect

and can a diy'fer safely remove asbestos....if so where can one get the supplies needed...and at what cost
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Old 05-29-2013, 08:29 AM   #30
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Drywall Identification? Asbestos?


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Oh for sure, agree 100% there Greg, trouble is we don't have any tests to know who is prone to something like lung cancer and who isn't.
There are, but they are still being perfected. That is one reason why most of us are going to explain deeper when it comes to people inquiring about Radon mitigation, which is another story.

As for safely removing any materials that contain Asbestos in a home, if it is a large quantity, you are best to pay a removal company that has the correct equipment. If it is a small amount, you just do as I described before, in what to do.

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